# The Geocentric Design Of The Solar System

Gauragopala dasa: This photo is of the Geocentric system of the Solar System where the Planets and Sun orbit the Earth. A similar technologically advanced diorama of this structure is presently being built at Mayapur West Bengal India that will house the Vedic Planetarium opening in 2016.

It is similar because in Sadupta dasa’s Book, Vedic Cosmology, he explains how the Moon is closer to the Earth Planet than the Sun, although on many occasions on morning walks and lectures, Srila Prabhupada has said that the Sun is closer and to arrive at the Moon one must first travel past the Sun.

The other so called hypothesis is the Helocentric design where the Sun is the center of the Solar system meaning all the Planets orbit the Sun which is the present day scientific explanation that Srila Prabhupada rejected.

As devotee of the Gaudiya teachings and ISKCON we only accept the shastric explanation given to us by Srila Prabhupada who clearly says the Geocentric system is the correct one as the photo attempts to show.

Actually the Helocentric theory is relatively new, even the Catholic Church officially believes in the Geocentric system as does the teachings of Islam.

Only due to modern science and the beginning of the so called age of ‘Enlightenment’ in the 17th Century did modern man start questioning all major Religious teachings of the Geocentric system however, as devotees we fully accept the authority of the Srimad Bhagavatam given to us by Srila Prabhupada meaning we accept the Geocentric model only.

As from 2016 when the Temple of the Vedic Planetarium is finished, the Geocentric System will become more known to the world and to many devotees who have not studied the 5th Canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam in detail.

This will definitely create more interest in the Geocentric design and the Krsna Conscious Movement and without a doubt it will create great interest where many documentaries around the world on this subject will bring many millions of people to Mayapur.

Of course modern science will challenge the Srimad Bhagavatam while other will come to accept the great wisdom of the Vedas and Srila Prabhupada’s Book that are found today in most languages around the world.

So get ready for 2016 when the wisdom of the Temple of the Vedic Planetarium in Mayapur comes on line for the whole world to see, bringing in a new (or very old) area of cosmology to the world. Hare Krsna all glorious to Srila Prabhupada

Your fallen servant Gauragopala dasa

But isn’t Vedic system “Merucentric”? With all the planets, including the Sun, going around Mount Meru?

The scientific view of the universe is just an extension of what is available to our senses, ie how the universe would look like if our eyes could see farther. Vedic sages, I understand, do not perceive the universe in the same way, not through their human sense organs, and so they have a very different concept of distances and spaces.

Maybe one day we will be able to map it out, maybe it’s impossible as a matter of principle.

Any thoughts?

Is there an artist out there who can paint a detailed map of how the Geocentric model would look like according to Srimad Bhagavatam that differs greatly from the Christian and Islamic Geocentric model the painting above is based on. The Srimad Bhagavatam model would have to show Venus and Mercury orbiting the sun as the sun orbits the earth (when seen from a geocentric point of view). Hare Krsna

This is a Geocentric model of the Solar System more in line with the Srimad Bhagavatam where Venus and Mercury orbit the Sun while the Sun orbits the Earth

https://www.facebook.com/gauragopala.dasa#!/photo.php?fbid=663780436974805&set=a.116728291680025.15845.100000285651436&type=1&theater

Sadapta dasa explains that Bhumandala is earth centered. Its innermost island, Jambudvipa, contains Bharata-varsha, which Srila Prabhupada has repeatedly identified as the planet earth.

In contrast, the orbits of the planets are centered on the sun. How, then, can they be compared to earth-centered features of Bhumandala?

The geocentric orbit of a planet is a product of two heliocentric motions, the motion of the earth around the sun and the motion of the planet around the sun. To draw it, we shift to the earth as center, and show planets like Mercury orbiting the sun, which in turn orbits the earth.

If we compare Bhu-mandala with the Earth, the solar system out to Saturn, and the Milky Way galaxy, Bhu-mandala matches the solar system closely, while radically differing in size from Earth and the galaxy.

The structures of Bhu-mandala correspond with the planetary orbits of the solar system If we compare the rings of Bhu-mandala with the orbits of Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn, we find several close alignments that give weight to the hypothesis that Bhu-mandala was deliberately designed as a map of the solar system. Hare Krsna

The Bhagavatam 5th Canto describes the planets revolving around Mount Meru attached by ropes of wind known as pravaha. The earth is closest to Mount Meru, followed by the Sun, Moon, Mars and so on. Also the Sun is 14,00,000 times bigger than the Earth and the Moon is twice as large as the Sun. The above model needs to be modified quite a bit before it can be implemented in the Vedic planetarium, since we need to present the Bhagavatam’s version whether or not it conforms to the modern “scientific” version or not. Hare Krishna!

Merucentric is Geocentric. Bhumandala is the solar system and is earth centered. Bhumandala is far too big to be the earth, but in size it turns out quite a reasonable match for the solar system.

Mount Meru is situated in the center of Bhumandala and shaped like an inverted cone, with a radius ranging from 8,000 yojanas at the bottom to 16,000 yojanas at the top.

Bhumandala’s innermost island, Jambudvipa, contains Bharata-varsha, which Shrila Prabhupada has repeatedly identified as the planet earth so Merucentric is Geocentric

In the Bhagavatam, Bhumandala—the “earth mandala”—is a disk 500 million yojanas in diameter. The yojana is a unit of distance about 8 miles long, and so the diameter of Bhumandala is about 4 billion miles. Bhumandala is marked by circular features designated as islands and oceans.

Bhumandala appears to be a highly artificial portrayal of the earth as an enormous flat disk, with continents and oceans that do not tally with geographical experience. But careful consideration shows that Bhumandala does not really represent the earth at all. To see why, we have to consider the motion of the sun.

In the Bhagavatam the sun is said to travel on a chariot. The wheel of this chariot is made of parts of the year, such as months and seasons. So it might be argued that the chariot is meant to be taken metaphorically, rather than literally. But here we are concerned more with the chariot’s dimensions than with its composition. The chariot has an axle that rests at one end on Mount Meru, in the center of Jambudvipa

The sun rides on a platform joined to the axle at an elevation of 100,000 thousand yojanas from the surface of Bhumandala. Since the axle extends from Mount Meru to Mount Manasottara, its length must be 15,750 thousand yojanas, or 157.5 times as long as the height of the sun above Bhumandala. Since the sun’s platform is somewhere on the axle between Meru (in the center) and the wheel (running on the circular track of Manasottara), it follows that to an observer at the center the sun always seems very close to the surface of Bhumandala.

Information gathered from Sadaputa dasa Hare Krsna

Here is the explanation of the same concept through Video by Sadaputa Prabhu

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yzH2n7MLM8

Mercury and Venus circle sun.

You can begin the calculation in the following way. Fifth canto SB explains the “chariot of the sun” is 28800000 miles long.

By several other verses which give different figures we can understand that the “chariot of the sun” has to be multiplied by 30.

This figure 30 is the number of muhurtas. 30 x 28800000 is 864000000, now this is the sun at 23.5 degrees south

Similarly a figure is there in Bhagavatam 756000000 that is the sun at 0 degrees celestial Then the sun goes to the north to 648000000

All this means is that you can demonstrate this to yourself on a ball. Take only one half of the ball and wrap sewing around it so that it gradually moves away from the center towards the top so that at every moment the sun is moving up and closer to the earth.

This means that the sun is further away when it goes to the south 23.5 degrees and closer as he moves northward.

This is confirmed in Matsya Purana that the sun is gathering water from the entire universe up to Dhruvaloka. Therefore the sun changes sizes as he moves up and down. In the spring and summer he is gathering water then he releases the water. We do not notice any change in size because he changes distance.

The modern scientist speculates that sun is only ball of gases. What we see in telescopes are only the clouds surrounding sun composed of water the sun has drawn there.

Information from Mayesa dasa based on decoding the 5th Canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam

Decoding the 5th Canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam with mathematical formals

Chariot of the sun diagram

How to draw the description in 5th Canto Srimad Bhagavatam.

The diagram of the sun is from the side explained in this way – .

First take a square.

(It will be helpful if you make it three or four inches on each side because we will be writing under or on top of those lines numbers later on)

Then inside the square draw a circle. Where the circle touches the top and sides draw lines. That divides the circle into four quadrants. It looks something like a gun site. (A square with a circle inside with a cross inside that)

This circle we will borrow the image of a clock to help us label its “points” I have already written how to draw it but let us go over it a gain. I may have made a small error before. ( I will also draw this out as I describe it where I am sitting typing this so I do not make an error) We shall label points where lines intersect as A, B, C, etc Then we can give the numbers of miles for these lines.

Where the two lines intersect in the middle of our circle will be point A

Where the horizontal middle line intersects the circle on the right will be B. (This is where the circle touches the square on the right) At two ‘o’clock we will make a point C

Between two o’clock and three o’clock (on the clock face-the circle- exactly midway between C and B) make point D

Draw horizontal line from C to center vertical line. That point is E

Draw horizontal line from point D to center vertical line. That is point F

We now have all our points. They should be on three parallel lines in the upper right quadrant of our circle.

We need two more lines.

Draw a line from point C to point F

Draw a line from point F to point B

We now have our points and lines.

This is how to draw the diagram of the sun from Srimad Bhagavatam.

(It should look like two flags or pennants, one upside down and one right side up, the lower one larger and the upper one smaller.)

Continued next post

Decoding the 5th Canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam with mathematical formals continued

In the second step we will now insert numbers that are miles of distance.

Constructing diagram of Chariot of the Sun

Second Step

Now we shall write on top of or under our lines the numbers of the distances between all the points above.

Line AB is 137509870.8

Line BD is 56400000 (Although this line is circular it is called a line)

Line CD is 56400000 (Although this line is circular it is called a line)

Line FB is 149946415.4

Line FD is 120321137

Line AF is 59790993.67

Line FC is 112459811.5

Line EC is 103132403.1

Line EF is 44843245.13

NOTE:

The chariot of the sun in 5th Canto Bhagavatam is said to be 28800000. The meaning is that this is the sun’s greatest distance of movement in a muhurta. (There are 30 muhurtas in a 24-hour period) He travels different distances every day. In fact he loses 39425 miles every muhurta so that we can know the distance the next day. 864000000 minus (39425 times 30) which is 862817250.

This will become obvious after you understand the math of the Sun’s chariot diagram

Now step three

If the circumference of the sun is 28800000 times 30 = 864000000 we divided by 2 and by 3.141592654=137509870.8

That is line AB

(The formula is circumference divided by 2 and by PI-Pi is 3.141592654. Pi is number that has no end because there is always (theoretically) a measurement smaller on a circle) 137509870.8 divide by cos (23.5) is 149946415.3 That is line FB

The formula we used is the formula for finding the hypotenuse of a right triangle if we know the bottom side. (Mathematicians have several different names for the bottom of a right triangle. I like to refer to it as the “floor” or “bottom” Hypotenuse I call the “roof” because it slants. Or I just call it hypotenuse. The smallest side I call the “wall.”)

The hypotenuse squared minus the floor squared equals the wall.

That gives us line AF

Line FD is 756000000 divide by 2 and divide by PI

(We get the figure 756000000 from Vayu and Linga Puranas)

These math formulas can be used to get line EC and EF

In order to get the arc or circular lines on our diagram we divide 864000000 by 360.

(There are 360 degrees in a circle)

Then we multiply that number by the degrees we wish to know. 864000000 divided by 360 times 23.5 = 56400000

Contined next post

Decoding the 5th Canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam with mathematical formals continued

NOTE:

If we came from the outside of the universe at its top we would look down and see the sun circling Meru (which would be the unmoving center of a circle.) in a clockwise fashion.

We would see Meru in the center, then earth out to its side (maybe stationary) then the moon circling Meru and the earth n a clockwise fashion then the sun circling Meru and the moon and the earth in a clockwise fashion etc.

That is not the diagram of the sun.

The diagram of the sun is what you would see if you came from outside of this universe from the side of the universe.

The diagram is like a snapshot of the sun’s movement. But it is on a piece of paper or on a screen, which is flat (one dimensional) and does not show that the sun is moving in three dimensions.

The sun starts at point B and moves towards the viewer (leaving the page) and then to the left side of our square and then backs behind it…in this way it has a circular movement. (Three-dimensional)

This is described in the Bhagavatam as just like an axle that is fixed to the top of Meru.

The suns circle is getting smaller everyday and he is moving northward at the same time.

He continues like this until he reaches his highest height and begins to descend in the same matter. As he descends he begins to add 30 times 39425 miles every 24 hours.

The chariots of the other planets and their distances can be derived from Bhagavatam also.

All information from Mayesa dasa. Hare Krsna. All glorious to Srila Prabhupada

The universe has an edge in every direction where the universe ends and the spiritual world begins,

We are in the spiritual world always but we are now in a portion that is covered over by matter. It is just like a machine with moving parts.

This universe is a machine with moving parts-the planets. It is just like a clock. Because the scientists cannot find the winder and maintainer of that clock they conclude wrongly everything.

There is a central line east and west, north and south because the universe has dimensions. (Maha Visnu is breathing out each universe)

Meru is located on that central line. And the planets, according to Vedic sastra turn around that. A form of wind is propelling them. Mount Meru is in each material universe. It is non other than the stable of a gigantic lotus flower, which grows from the navel of Lord Vishnu. On the top is situated Satyaloka where Lord Brahma resides.

This lotus flower is also Virat Rupa of the Lord. In his upper portions is situated the heavenly planet, in his middle portions is situated the earthly planets and in the lower portions is situated the lower – hellish planets.

The hells are located underneath Bhuloka. Then below the hells are the subterranean planets. It is there in 5th Canto Srimad Bhagavatam. Bhuloka is always pictured as flat but it is described as roundish in Surya Siddhanta. So it is like an upside down bowl and the hells are underneath

The single Sun moves around this Mount Meru and all other planets move around the Sun and Mount Meru.

The modern scientists take no help from sastra and speculate that every force is material. But they have not been able to create a “living body” or bring a dead body to life. They simply speculate. And unintelligent people are impressed with their mindless speculation.

Sadaputa presents the Bhuloka or Jambudvipa and Meru as well as other islands and seas as flat. According to Surya Siddhanta it is round like and upside down bowl.

With Meru on the top it is in the center. One reason mathematically it is so, is that the planets are having degrees north and south and they should not “crash into ” Bhuloka. If the planets crash into Bhuloka then we take Bhuloka as a “subtle” land or as “symbolic” of other things. Bhu is this land, bhavah is outer space, sva is upper spaces as in Om bhur bhuvah svah tat…

continued next post

This is also true because in 5th canto Ch 21 Canto 5 text 7 it is said that there is “sunrise, sunset, midday and midnight” on the four corners of Bhu loka. This can only be if it is round. If it were flat the sun would be further away but always seen in the sky.

It is a contentious point that Srila Prabhupada might not have revealed all about this matter to us he knew, or that he might have counted upon us to research it in depth and find out more than he reveals.

But let me give you an example of this possibility. The earth is always thought to be the planet that Lord Varaha lifts from the ocean at the end of partial pralay. But in many Puranas Varaha lifts the entire Bhuloka from the waters. Even Meru has been dislodged and He restores it.

Krauncha dvipa is one of the seven islands surrounding Meru. There is said in the Puranas that Krauncha dvipa has the mark of one of Lord Varaha’s tusks in it. If Srila Prabhupada did not go into this in great detail, this may be due to our beginning nature as devotee

Sadaputa dasa has taken the approach that the dimensions are not perceivable by the senses. But if we are calculating the distance to the sun from Bhagavatam, the sun is a perceivable object. Then suddenly Meru is not perceivable?

So we have to distinguish what we mean by unperceivable. Do we mean because it is out of view? India was out of my view before I visited there. But I was able to perceive it in other ways. Or is something imperceptible because it is composed of subtle matter?

In a morning walk Srila Prabhupada mentioned a mountain of Gold. He was referring to Meru. And he said, “If they learn of it they shall be mad to go there.” Go where? If it is subtle matter the people could never go there.

The Ganges water is falling on Lord Siva’s head, on a mountain known as Kailasa 80,000 miles tall or so. If the Ganges is real is not the mountain and Lord Siva’s form also real?

Today I listened to a lecture on the 9th Ch of Bhagavad Gita as it is given in 1976 in Melbourne Australia in the question and answer portion Srila Prabhupada clearly explained that the moon is higher than the sun in that it travels higher than the sun. Often this is misunderstood. People hear this and think his meaning is that the moon is “further away” than the Sun. This is clearly “not” his meaning. If something amazing could exist in this multi-layered approach it could certainly exist in a single universe theory also.

Contined next post

Sometimes the magician is very wonderful and we cannot see how he has defied logic. But it is a simple trick.

Because you do not “see” Meru does not mean it is not there. It defies our so-called logic, because we are like animals that within this body there is something eternal. It defies our foolish minds that Brahma has got a lifespan from the beginning of the universe to the end.

So many things are beyond our capabilities. We should not try to bring them down to our puny way of understanding.

There is one insect that lives thru the night. He hovers around the light. In the morning you can sweep those dead insects into a pile. Those insects cannot imagine your lifespan. They would think it “imagination” If they were clever they would say,” That must be in an alternate universe-certainly not in ‘mine'”

The scientists or the layman look at a photograph of the sun from their telescopes and space probes and explain that the entire sun is nothing but burning gases. They cannot reproduce this sun even on the tiniest scale in their laboratory. They have never experienced any thing like the sun on this earth that continues to burn. They have created the atomic bomb but it burns out. It does not continue to burn like the sun. The scientists cannot imagine that it is possible because they cannot do it.

They speculate that the sun is a “chain reaction of gases exploding from within to then moving to the suns surface ” All speculation.

They cannot imagine that they are seeing the clouds around the sun and that underneath these clouds there is a race of people living there.

Their limited experience is that heat makes water evaporate and turn into clouds however, they do not imagine that that water travels in atomic form to the sun itself as the Puranas explain and is then expelled in the same way.

Modern scientists also cannot extract water from certain gases, they also do not think water is there in outer space but because they are unable to presently see its existence, that does not mean it cannot be there.

Contined next post

On this earth at the north and south poles under the water, fish are living and also in the human body there are fierce temperatures in the stomach acid where microbes and bacteria are living. The idea of people living on the sun is not within the modern scientists ability to fathom at present.

But remember, scientists do not believe there is a soul in the body which cannot be burned etc (as described in second chapter of Bhagavad-gita) they cannot imagine varieties of bodies constructed to withstand extreme temperatures.

Modern science works exclusively on the principle that “all is matter” and life must only be here or on one similar planet that can support the kind of life we have here.

Maha Visnu is lying in the Causal Ocean and glances over material nature introducing the myriad living entities into this universe in the same way Vivasvan, an incarnation of the Lord, is drawing the material molecules or atoms of water.

Matsya Purana says that the Sun is drawing water from Bhuloka up to Dhruvaloka. If the sun is “drawing” water isn’t it possible for him to “draw it” all the way to Himself?

All information from Mayesa dasa. Hare Krsna. All glorious to Srila Prabhupada

The following questions and answers are taken from “Vedic Cosmography and Astronomy” by Dr. Richard L. Thompson (Sadaputa dasa) which was published in 1989 by the Bhaktivedanta Book Trust Sadaputa dasa is a founding member of the Bhaktivedanta Institute, the scientific branch of ISKCON.

[From Chapter Eight – Questions and Answers]

Q: Using radar and lasers, scientists have recently obtained very accurate estimates of the earth-moon distance. This distance is about 238,000 miles. How do you reconcile this with Vedic calculations?

A: According to surya-siddhanta the distance from the earth globe to the moon is about 258,000 miles. This is in reasonable agreement with the modern value.

Q: The Vedic literature says that the moon is higher than the sun. How can this be?

A: In Chapter 22 of the Fifth Canto, the heights of the planets above the earth are given, and it is stated that the moon is 100,000 yojanas above the rays of the sun.

In this chapter, the word “above” means “above the plane of Bhu-mandala”. It does not refer to distance measured from the surface of the earth globe. We show that if the plane of Bhu-mandala corresponds to the plane of the ecliptic, then it indeed makes sense to say that the moon is higher than the sun relative to Bhu-mandala. This does not mean that the moon is farther from the earth globe than the sun.

Several times in the Caitanya-Caritamrita, Srila Prabhupada refers to the surya-siddhanta, which was spoken by a messenger from the sun god, surya, at the end of the last Satya-yuga. Srila Bhaktisiddhanta SarasvatI translated it into Bengali. In the Caitanya-caritamrta (Adi 1.3.8p), Prabhupada writes:

These calculations are given in the authentic astronomy book known as the surya-siddhanta. This book was compiled by the great professor of astronomy and mathematics Bimal Prasad Datta, later known as Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami, who was our merciful spiritual master. He was honored with the title Siddhanta Sarasvati for writing surya-siddhanta, and the title Gosvami Maharaja was added when he accepted sannyasa, the renounced order of life.

Hare Krsna

BHURLOKA

Bhurloka, or Bhu-mandala is the earthly level consisting of seven spheres (dvipas) – Jambudvipa, Plaksadvipa, Salmalidvipa, Kusadvipa, Krauncadvipa, Sakadvipa, Puskaradvipa – which are inhabited by various human beings.

“The planetary system known as Bhu-mandala resembles a lotus flower, and its seven islands resemble the whorl of that flower. The length and breadth of the island known as Jambudvipa, which is situated in the middle of the whorl, are one million yojanas [eight million miles]. Jambudvipa is round like the leaf of a lotus flower.” (SB 5.16.5)

The planet Earth is situated within Jambudvipa. It is known as karma-bhumi (Visnu Purana 2.3.2), the place where new karma is created, a kind of cosmic crossroad. Here I will decide about my future situation, higher or lower, by acting in a particular way (not that “all paths are the same” – yatha mata tatha pata).

“King Rahugana said: This birth as a human being is the best of all. Even birth among the demigods in the heavenly planets is not as glorious as birth as a human being on this earth. What is the use of the exalted position of a demigod? In the heavenly planets, due to profuse material comforts, there is no possibility of associating with devotees.” (SB 5.13.21)

Hare Krsna

In relation to comment number 14 – The first reconcilation can be accepted but the second attempt is speculation since there are clear statements by Srila Prabhupada which can be reconciled only if the scientists change their world view according to the Vedic version. Pratyaksa pramana can be accepted only if is in accordance with sabda pramana.

Prabhupada: But this is the arrangement all over the world. Sunday first, Monday second, then Tuesday. So Sun, Moon, Mars, Jupiter, in this way. Last Saturn. This is the arrangement of the planets. So if this is the arrangement of the planets, moonday next to…, moon next to sun, and if you cannot go to the sun, how can you go to the moon?

Reporter: Do you, in other words, do you believe that astronauts landed somewhere?

Prabhupada: That is next question. First of all, whether you actually went to the moon, that is the first question. You have to conclude that you did not, because the sun planet is first, the moon planet is second. You cannot go to the sun planet, ninety-three millions of miles, how can you go to the moon planet?

Reporter: Well, except that…

Prabhupada: According to our sastra, the moon planet is above the sun planet, and the distance is 1,600,000 miles. So accepting that the sun is 93,000,000 miles away, then you add another 1,600,000, almost 2,000,000, it becomes 15,000,000 miles away. So if you go at the speed of 18,000 miles per hour, it takes more than 6 months. So how you go there in 4 days? And you advertise in the paper: “Now, they have reached.” After 4 days.

Ramesvara: They don’t accept that the moon is further away.

Prabhupada: They don’t accept, that is another thing, but we have got this information. How we can accept it?

Reporter: I didn’t understand that last.

Ramesvara: I said to Prabhupada that the modern man believes that the moon is closer, but

Prabhupada said, “But our ancient literatures teach that the moon is further away.” So since we have that information, how can we accept the version of the modern scientists?

Morning Walk, Honolulu, 06/02/1975

Devotee (3): Prabhupada, when they said they went to the moon and they showed films of them landing and walking on the moon, was this all a bluff?

Prabhupada: Yes, here they… All laboratory work, that’s all.

Devotee (3): They all made it up?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Devotee (3): They say because the atmosphere is not like this planet, others cannot live there.

Prabhupada: Why not atmosphere? The moon planet, there is a planet. There is space. There is surface. There is dust. So why not atmosphere the same? It is made of the same ingredients, earth, water, fire. Why do you say that is not same atmosphere?

Paramahamsa: Srila Prabhupada, people will be very surprised to find out that the moon is farther away from us than the sun when they read your…, when they read Fifth Canto.

Prabhupada: But at least, they could not go there. Otherwise, why they are giving up this job? They could not go there. That’s a fact. Their plan was to… They were selling land even on the moon planet.

Ambarisa: Selling land on the moon?

Prabhupada: Yes. (laughter)

Srutakirti: They were selling airline tickets also.

Prabhupada: Ah, yes. (laughter) Just see, route. Pan American, yes. They sold so many tickets. Such fools there are.

Indian man: Just like you said that this moon and other planets are also made of these five elements — earth, water, fire, ether — they brought a rock from there. So they are accepting that the moon is made of those elements also. But they are not accepting that life is there.

Prabhupada: No, they’ll not accept. Therefore… therefore fools. Why? The circumstance is the same. Why there should be no life? That is foolishness. We have got experience. As soon as there is water, there is life. As soon as there is land, there is life. As soon as there is air, there is life. So where is life? No life.

Devotee (3): They may agree in undeveloped species, but as far as higher forms of life, they will not agree, such as humans or demigods.

Prabhupada: No, that also we cannot agree. If there are lower species, there must be higher species. As we see here is dog also, man also, higher species, lower species, why not there? They can talk all nonsense, but a nonsense will believe. No sane man will believe. [break] …going to meet in the space?

Ambarisa: Yes.

Prabhupada: What is the idea?

Continued next post

Ambarisa: It’s a diplomatic move. They feel it will make friendly relationships between the two countries.

Indian man: They cannot meet on the earth and they are going to meet on the… (laughter) [break]

Prabhupada: So I am the only man in the world challenging that “You have not gone to the moon planet.” Eh?

Harikesa: Is it possible there’s some difference as to the definition of what the moon planet is? They will say that the moon planet is that planet out there. Do we agree? At night?

Prabhupada: What is your definition? First of all let me hear.

Harikesa: I’m still wondering myself.

Prabhupada: We have got our definition.

Harikesa: What do we call those planets that rotate around Jupiter and Saturn and… They will say those are also moons.

Prabhupada: Yes. Different planets, different position. Just like this sun planet is fiery. There is fire. Similarly, in moon planet there is fire, but it is surrounded by cold atmosphere. Therefore it is cooling.

Harikesa: So that’s the specific characteristic of this moon?

Prabhupada: Which moon? Yes, this is…

Harikesa: Our moon.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Harikesa: So the other moons that rotate around Saturn and Jupiter…

Prabhupada: Other moon? There is no other moon.

Harikesa: So they’re just planets?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Paramahamsa: The moon is not rotating around the earth. The moon is further away than the sun.

Harikesa: The moon is further away than the sun. Wow! (laughs)

Prabhupada: Yes.

Harikesa: Why does it seem like the moon is…

Prabhupada: Seen? Who has seen it? First of all let me…, who has seen it? (Devotees are laughing)

Harikesa: There’s nothing you can say.

Ambarisa: Prabhupada, you said the other day that pretty soon all these lies will be exposed.

Prabhupada: They are already exposed because they have left that expedition. That means they are hopeless. That is exposed. But foolish people will not ask them that “Why you have stopped this expedition?” They will again go on bluffing, and they will accept. That is the position. Now people should ask them, “Why you have stopped moon expedition and Venus expedition? You proposed you were going there, making arrangement. Why you have stopped?” It is failure.

Harikesa: They might argue…

Continued next post

Prabhupada: What is the argument? You have stopped. That is your failure, that’s all. You can argue to the laymen, foolish men, but we will say you have stopped; therefore it is failure. All bogus propaganda is now stopped.

Harikesa: I’ve heard the argument that when they are going to the moon, they are always in contact, bouncing off these sonar waves and radar waves off the moon’s surface, and when they are coming near, they can even see from their little portholes the moon’s surface, the same moon that they see on the earth.

Prabhupada: They say all nonsense. That’s all. (chuckles) Why the earth is not brilliant at night like the moon?

Bali-mardana: It depends on where you are. It depends on where you are looking from.

Prabhupada: “Where you are” means?

Harikesa: They have pictures from the moon taken of the earth.

Prabhupada: Pictures? First of all you see. Then take picture. You cannot see.

Harikesa: They use all these things to argue that they actually did go to the moon.

Prabhupada: What is the meaning of argument if they have stopped? That is failure. Don’t talk nonsense anymore. Phalena pariciyate. By the result we have to understand. Your result is you are failure. Then what is the use of talking nonsense? Stop this nonsense.

Harikesa: I’m still astounded by the fact that the moon is further away than the sun. When the devotees hear this tape, they’re not going to believe it.

Prabhupada: Therefore they could not go. I… First of all I said that they might have gone to the Rahu planet.

Harikesa: Yes, the Fourth Canto.

Prabhupada: Yes. First of all my conviction: they have gone nowhere. They have simply stayed in their laboratory, that’s all.

Indian man: Anyone can do that, bring some pictures and bring a rock.

Paramahamsa: Srila Prabhupada, I think somebody might have told you before, but there was a big scandal right after the moon shot when they said they went to the moon and…, that it was all staged in the desert of Arizona, that they…

Prabhupada: Yes, that is the fact.

Bali-mardana: When Purusottama heard that, he blooped. (Devotees continue laughing.)

Prabhupada: Yes. In 1968 I was questioned by the reporters, “What is your opinion about this moon? It is simply a waste of time and energy, that’s all. It is all false propaganda.” I told to the reporter.

Continued next post.

Harikesa: Actually, these scientists and philosophers, they become very famous and popular by coming up with some brand new theories. So why don’t we widely publicize our theories?

Devotee (3): [break] …real information about the moon from the Bhagavatam?

Prabhupada: Veda. Veda means knowledge.

Harikesa: Srila Prabhupada, do we say that they’ve gone to Rahu simply to placate them?

Prabhupada: No, accidentally they went to Rahu. Maybe. That is also not…

Indian man: [break]…gone at all outside this atmosphere of earth.

Prabhupada: Yes. [break] …haven’t gone to moon planet, that is my… [break] …why they will give it up? That is the proof. America was found by Columbus. So many people came from Europe and utilized it. So if they would have gone to moon planet, they would have utilized it. But they have not gone. That is the fact.

Paramahamsa: That was their original proposal, that they can utilize it, make colonies there.

Prabhupada: Yes, yes. Yes.

Devotee (3): The moon exploration, because they thought that we cannot use the moon like Columbus, they used America.

Prabhupada: That is your excuse.

Paramahamsa: They say it’s too much like the desert.

Harikesa: That’s cause they were in the desert. (laughs)

Prabhupada: [break] …grow so many nice dates, you know that? You cannot say in the desert there is no…

Paramahamsa: Oh, yes. Arabia they grow.

Prabhupada: Yes, yes. [break] …desert nice watermelon will grow. Yes. Nice dates. So people go there, take the dates and take the watermelon. Krishna has provided food even there. [break]

Harikesa: Would one see gross form on a subtle planet?

Prabhupada: Hmm?

Harikesa: Like the moon planet is heavenly planet. They’re supposed to have subtle bodies there. So would there be any gross forms?

Prabhupada: Why subtle body? That is material body.

Harikesa: So we would not be able to see any traces of a civilization?

Prabhupada: There is civilization. You have not gone there, rascal. You are simply imagining. (Devotees laugh) There is civilization. First thing is, you rascal, you did not go. You are talking only nonsense. That’s it.

Paramahamsa: [break] …Rahu planet, that’s a hellish planet?

Prabhupada: Yes. They might have gone to that hellish planet. That’s all.

Bali-mardana: No wonder they left.

Continued next post

Paramahamsa: That seems more befitting them.

Prabhupada: Yes. Yes!

Bali-mardana: They were not qualified to go to the moon, so Krishna sent them there.

Prabhupada: Yes, they are not qualified. Even in this planet, unless one is bona fide, he is not allowed to enter America. How you can go to the moon planet? That is demigods’ planet.

Harikesa: Some of the astronauts became very religious after they supposedly went.

Prabhupada: Yes, they are intelligent, that “This is all nonsense. Real thing is God.” That is… They come to their senses. They are intelligent. [break] (In car:) …real business is to enhance your Krishna consciousness. These people, they are wasting time simply to know something else. There is no limit. Klisyanti ye kevala-bodha-labdhaye. What is moon planet? What business you have got to know the…? Whatever is stated in the sastra, accept it, that’s all. What is the use of experiment and going there and then again say, “Oh, it is all failure.” Simply waste of time. The arrangement is there by God. That’s all. Spending so much money, hard-earned money, unnecessarily and then say, “Oh, it is failure.”

Paramahamsa: If they were a little bit intelligent and had some knowledge of the Vedas, they would learn that they could go there…

Prabhupada: The knowledge is already there. Just like I am speaking. I am not a scientist. On the knowledge of Vedas, that’s all.

Paramahamsa: Yes. Just like you have said in the Easy Journey to Other Planets, you can go there by the mystic yoga process. You don’t have to make some space machine.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Ambarisa: The scientists want to go there without performing any kind of austerities.

Prabhupada: But there is austerities.

Paramahamsa: Yeah, actually they end up performing greater austerity.

Prabhupada: You have to earn money with so much labor and spend it for nothing.

Paramahamsa: Billions of dollars. Some of them are working like madmen.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Paramahamsa: They work all day and most of the night. [break]

Prabhupada: …expedition is exposition of the scientists: useless. But these materialistic persons will be cheated again and again. Punah punar carvita-carvananam [SB 7.5.30]. The scientists will propose something else and they will accept. They will never say that “You are failure in your moon expedition. Why you are proposing again something nonsense?” They will never ask. They will pay me, “Yes.”

Continued next post

Ambarisa: The government doesn’t want the people in general to know that the scientists are failures because they feel that the people will be put into a lot of anxiety because of this. So they…

Prabhupada: No, they are already in anxiety. This material world means anxiety. So many problems there are. Sada samudvigna-dhiyam asad-grahat. Because they accepted this material world as all in all, samudvigna, they are full of anxiety. Just like if you are on a boat and if you know that after some hours the boat will be drowned, then can you remain without anxiety?

Paramahamsa: They have some relief, though, because they think that the scientists will be able to protect them.

Prabhupada: This is their position. This is their position. Just like we are in this car, but we know it, that any moment there can be accident. So how we can be without anxiety? In the material world, on account of this material condition, we are not going to stay here. There must be anxiety. But if we close our eyes, that is different thing. Otherwise it is full of anxiety. [break] “… be free from anxiety, then surrender to Me. What I say, do it.” That he will not do. They will manufacture their own way of life. They must be in anxiety. They will never hear what Krishna says. And our propaganda is that “Just you become Krishna conscious, and you will be happy.” This is our… That they will not do.

Ambarisa: …’60, 1960. When did they start to go to the moon?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Ambarisa: I think President Kennedy started the program in 1960.

Vedic Cosmology Decoding the 5th Canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam

At first glance the 5th Canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam deals only with a picturesque vision of the universe. While working with Danavir Gosvami Maharaja and his team in India on deciphering this valuable text, I became convinced that there had to be a mathematical formula to unlock the 5th canto’s mystery. If you will take a few minutes to read this article you will begin to understand the thrill of discovering what is contained in these cryptic verses

Sun, Moon and Rahu

Part One Rahu

At the official web site address for NASA below you may scroll down and find a section labeled Orbital parameters. Scroll down to Inclination to the equator (deg)

http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/factsheet/moonfact.html

You will find here 18.28-28.58 This is called declination. If you have a globe and you draw a line around its circumference that is 0 degrees.

Either side of that line, any point you make will be on some degree of the ball. On this website NASA says that the degree of the moons travel is from 18.28 degrees to 28.58 degrees And sometimes he goes as much as 28.58 degrees. The sun goes only to approx 23.5 degrees.

The meaning of this is that as the moon travels back and forth across the equator it never goes to less than 18.28 degrees. In the Srimad Bhagavatam 5th Canto Ch 24 text 2 we find the following:

The sun globe, which is a source of heat, extends for 10,000 yojanas [80,000 miles]. The moon extends for 20,000 yojanas [160,000 miles], and Rahu extends for 30,000 yojanas [240,000 miles]…

Before we proceed to show the incredible accuracy of the Srimad Bhagavatam we must know something about the size of the earth. The modern calculation of the earth is 24902 miles in circumference. Divide this number by 360 to know what each degree would be separately.

24902 divided by 360 = 69.172222 We must also know that there are 60 minutes in an hour and 60 seconds in a minute and 24 hours in a day.

The Bhagavatam verse gives the timing of the eclipses down to the second. The Vedas also divide the day into 86400 seconds, into minutes of sixty seconds.

It all works out the same whether you use minutes or muhutas (forty-eight minutes is a muhutas) or hours. The seconds are exactly identical because the unit of 86400 seconds a day is the same.

Continued next post

These particular calculations are for measuring three different things which science (modern) agrees with.

86400 divided by 60 divided by 60 equals 24. 24 hours of sixty minutes containing sixty seconds.

And we must know similarly that degrees on a circle also can be measured in this way. We shall begin with Rahu. This means in this case the lowest degree to the equator. (the moon travels from zero to 18.28 at its lowest and 0 to 28.58 at its highest.

The figure of the size of Dhruvaloka is 512157669. Dhruvaloka is said to be a planet at the extreme North of the universe. How we derive the figure for Dhruva loka we shall show later. The 5th Canto is a precise mathematical puzzle with interlocking parts.

The last number mentioned in the Bhagavatam in a previous chapter was for Dhruvaloka. So we utilize Dhruvaloka for our next mathematical problem.

512157669 divided by 240000 =2133.990288 Square this (multiply number by itself) = 4553914.547 Now divide by 60, Divide by 60 again. And divide by a single degree of the earth 69.172=18.28734458

What did the NASA website say? It said 18.28

Moon Fact Sheet – http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/factsheet/moonfact.html

Part Two Length of Sun’s eclipse

Utilizing again data, which can be found by googling eclipse or googling length of eclipses, we learn that there are two main eclipses. There is a lunar eclipse. And there is a solar eclipse. Both of these eclipses have been timed by modern science. Would you be surprised to learn that their exact times are found in the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam?

Again we begin with the number of miles around Dhruvaloka. (We shall show how to get this number later ) And we follow the instructions found in Canto 5 Ch 24 Text 2 of Srimad Bhagavatam

512157669 divide by 80000 = 6401.970863 Square this number (multiply it by itself) = 40985230.92

Now divide by the minutes of an eclipse of the sun which if you google it you will find is 25214

25214 is 7 minutes and 14 seconds or 7 times 60 times 60 plus 14. So again we divide 40985230.92 by 25214=1625.495. Now divide that by a single degree of the earth 1625.495 divide by 69.172=23.499

The length of the longest possible solar eclipse then is approx 7 minutes 14 seconds At least the Srimad Bhagavatam and modern science think so.

Continued next post

Part Three The length of a lunar eclipse.

We are showing that ancient astronomers were far from ignorant about the most modern calculations of the sun and moon.

The longest lunar eclipse is estimated on various sites you can google. Here is how we derive this figure from Srimad Bhagavatam 5th Canto Ch 24 text 2

First we take the number of miles circumference of the planet Dhruvaloka and begin 512157669 divide by 160000 = 3200.985431 Now we square that number (multiply the number by itself) = 10246307.73 Now divide this number by the minutes in a lunar eclipse, which is 359496

This number 359496 is 99.86 minutes. Or 98.86 times 60 times 60 = 359496. So we divide 10246307.73 by 359496 = 28.5

Of course my number for Dhruva could be off a fraction or my number for the circumference of the earth but we see how so very accurate the Srimad Bhagavatam is. We have an accurate measurement of the moon’s lowest declination

We have an accurate time of solar eclipse. And we have an accurate time of lunar eclipse. At first, it may escape us how much has been revealed in this one verse.

We have learned the movement of the moon without spending a moment surveying the stars. We have learned the size and shape of the earth without experiment. We have learned the length of lunar and solar eclipses without timing them. And how did the ancients time these things without watches?

It appears such revelations as these put a hole in the theory that mankind is descended from primitive men. Modern Science has not improved a fraction on these conclusions. One wonders what other amazing information is to be found in the 5th canto Srimad Bhagavatam.

Compiled by Mayesa dasa edited by Gauragopala dasa

If the Moon was further away from the Earth than the Sun, it would always appear as full when viewed from the Earth, because Moon reflects the rays of Sun. Try to model that with a light bulb (Sun) and a ball (Moon). When both Sun and Moon are present in the sky at the same time, it is very easy to see that the Moon is closer to the Earth by observing the pattern of light and shade on the Moon. All ancient civilizations, including Vedic, knew that, and the above quoted answer from Sadaputa Prabhu reflects that knowledge as contained in Surya Siddhanta. Bhagavatam does not say that the Moon is closer to Earth than Sun. It says that it is ‘above the sun rays’. That could refer to angular distance as viewed in the sky, or a planary distance with respect to the Garbha Ocean as Sadaputa suggests, or some other subtle relationship between these celestial bodies.

The argument: “But this is the arrangement all over the world. Sunday first, Monday second, then Tuesday” is even hardly supportive of the opposite thesis, because in many calendars all over the world Monday is considered a first day of the week, and the original order of the days of the week – as established by Babylonian astrologers – had nothing to do with linear distances from the earth, but assigned their planet gods to the days of the week based on their god’s prominence in daily life (Sun was obviously most important).

The planetary bodies are in movement. Sometimes the moon is further away from us than the sun?

Yes the sun’s chariot diagram shows sun at an angle north of us at 112459811.5 whereas when moon is at highest angle it is 112929729.4 that is 469917.9 miles difference. Also of course if we draw a line east and west across the universe the moon goes higher than the sun

Part One The Movement and Distances to the Planets

As we have shown in the sun chariot diagram the movement and distance to the sun planet is given us in 5th canto Srimad Bhagavatam. In fact, in an extremely clever way we are given distance and movement to the Moon, Venus, Mercury, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, the constellations, the 7 Sages (Big Dipper or Plough) and Dhruvaloka. We shall show in this article the math for each one.

Two things should be understood at the outset. One, this information is 5000 years old at least (it existed before that, but the book we are working from is that old) so it is not an attempt to challenge or correct modern science.

Modern science has changed its views about the movement of the planets many times and their distances as well. In fact, it is our contention that by losing access to this information modern science has had to develop a system (and there have been many) to explain the movement of the heavenly bodies, though each new system contains many contradictions.

The second thing that is important to understand is that the system, which you will discover here, is not arranged haphazardly after the fact. Rather, it seems the distances were known first and then a system for computing them in an easy manner was found. This will become clear only after familiarizing yourself with the system.

As we have previously shown the sun is given us. It is our beginning base of operations (If you do not understand this go back and familiarize yourself with the chariot of the sun article).

However, the math is simple and I explain every formula as we go along for the beginner

Part two: The Moon

In this section we shall not try to cover the shape of the orbits as I have done with the Sun’ chariot diagram. We shall leave that for later. But it is a fact that by taking help of this information we can construct an entire working model of the cosmos at least on a computer model. It could be done on a physical model as well but it would take considerable time and effort.

continued next post

This system begins with the middle of the sun’s circumferences. That is 756000000.

756000000 is the sun’s circumference around the earth at 0 degrees celestial (0 degrees celestial means at the earth’s equator) Divide by 756000000 by 360=2100000 Divide 2100000 by (31500000+800000) =. 06501548

Now multiply by 864000000 = 56173374.61 This number is the declination of the moon. Now we divide that by 28.5, which is the greatest declination of the moon. 56173374.61 divide by 28.5 = 1970995.6. This is one degree of the moon’s circumference at 0 degrees celestial. Multiply by 360 = 709558416.2 The moon’s circumference as it goes around the earth’s equator is 709558416.2

To find its distance divide by 2 and by PI The moon of course changes its distance and goes all the way up to the circumference 623572078.6 north and the same south. Multiplying the moons circumference by cos gets this number (28.50 by dividing these numbers by 2 and by Pi and multiplying by cos (28.5) we get the distance from earth to moon at these altitudes.

The next planetary body mentioned in the Bhagavatam (and in all the cosmology sections of the Puranas) is the constellations. They are mentioned now though they are outside the orbit of Saturn because this is a mathematical construct, not a chronological list. And because we shall from this point on use the constellations to calculate the planets.

Compiled by Mayesa das and edited by Gauragopala dasa

The Sun is NEVER closer to us than the Moon. At its closest point, known as the perigee, the Moon is only 363,104 km (225,622 miles) form Earth. And at its most distant point, called apogee, the Moon gets to a distance of 406,696 km (252,088 miles). Aphelion (when the Earth is the farthest from the Sun) occurs around the first week of July. The distance is about 152 million km (94.4 million miles). Perihelion (when the Earth is closest to the Sun) occurs in the first week of January. The distance is about 147 million km (91.3 million miles).

Since Sun and Moon have roughly the same angular diameter (apparent size in the sky), if the Moon was further away than the Sun it would mean that Moon is at least as big as the Sun, many times the size of the Earth, which in turn would make the Earth revolve around the Moon and not the other way – smaller celestial objects always revolve around bigger ones in accordance with the laws of gravity.

The notion that Moon is further away from Earth than the Sun is untenable.

Kulapavana dasa on post 26 has very rightly understood by intelligent experiments how the moon goes thru its phases. When the moon is in front of the sun we do not see the moon at all, this happens every month. That is the dark moon night that happens every month. Eclipse is different.

As long as the moon is within certain degrees of the suns position there is full day on the back of the moon. Yes, there are also partial eclipses for example the moon being in front the sun is an eclipse of the sun in certain areas of the earth

One may be able to calculate when an eclipse will happen by this information in Bhagavatam. The moon falls back 13 degrees everyday he is now at an angle to the moon.

In this way the light covers more and more of the moon till the moon arrives directly opposed to the moon and appears full. Moon “must” be within sun’s orbit at least when the moon is dark. It does not pass beyond the moon.

The “distant moon” explanation.

Let us consider this controversy through the lens of Vedic science and the four pramanas. To approach this dilemma in a Vedic scientific method, we should carefully examine all four types of evidence with indifference.

What does the Bhu-mandala model show?

The model shows that the Moon is farther from Bhu-mandala than the Sun is. Sadaputa Prabhu points out, “However, this distance refers to height above Bhu-mandala, and it does not say how far the sun is from the earth globe.” That we are presently working on

Since we do not perceive Bhu-mandala, which is described as a flat disk billions of miles in diameter in the plane of the ecliptic, it is presumptuous to jump to the conclusion that the distances of moon and sun from Bhu-mandala are the same as their distances from the earth globe.

However, another Vedic literature does give evidence about the distances of the moon and sun from earth. Srila Prabhupada accepted as authoritative Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati’s translation of “the authentic astronomy book known as Surya-siddhanta.” [CC AL 3.8p]

Surya-siddhanta – “explicitly assumes that eclipses are caused by the passage of the moon in front of the sun or into the earth’s shadow. It describes calculations based on this model that make it possible to predict the occurrence of both lunar and solar eclipses and compute the degree to which the disc of the sun or moon will be obscured.” – Vedic Cosmography and Astronomy by Richard L. Thompson (Sadaputa dasa)

Contined next post

Thus, according to Surya Siddhanta, the moon is closer to the earth than the sun. We can observe that only the side of the moon facing the sun is bright. As the moon approaches nearer to the sun, its crescent becomes thinner. It appears that the side away from the earth is lit by the sun, and the side toward the earth is dark. This indicates that the moon is between the earth and the sun, as Surya-siddhanta describes.

Compied by Mayesa dasa edited by Gauragopala dasa

Vedic Cosmography and Astronomy Q&A further understanding of Srila Prabhupada’s comments that the Moon is further away from Earth than the Sun

Excerpt from the book ‘Vedic Cosmography and Astronomy’ by Sadaputa dasa (Richard L. Thompson).

Q: In SB 8.10.38p, Shrila Prabhupada says, “The sun is supposed to be 93,000,000 miles above the surface of the earth, and from the Shrimad-Bhagavatam we understand that the moon is 1,600,000 miles above the sun. Therefore the distance between the earth and the moon would be about 95,000,000 miles.” Doesn’t this plainly say that the moon is farther from the earth than the sun?

A: In the summary at the end of Chapter 23 of the Fifth Canto Shrila Prabhupada says, “The distance from the sun to the earth is 100,000 yojanas.” At 8 miles per yojana, this comes to 800,000 miles. We suggest that when Shrila Prabhupada cites the modern Western earth-sun distance of 93,000,000 miles, he is simply making the point that if you put together the Bhagavatam and modern astronomy you get a contradictory picture. His conclusion is that one should simply accept the Vedic version, and he was not interested in personally delving into astronomical arguments in detail.

Q: What is your justification for going into these arguments in detail?

A: Shrila Prabhupada ordered some of his disciples to do this for the sake of preaching. In a letter to Svarupa Damodara dasa dated April 27, 1976, Shrila Prabhupada said, “Now our Ph.D.’s must collaborate and study the 5th Canto to make a model for building the Vedic Planetarium…. So now all you Ph.D.’s must carefully study the details of the 5th Canto and make a working model of the universe. If we can explain the passing seasons, eclipses, phases of the moon, passing of day and night, etc., then it will be very powerful propaganda.” In this regard, he specifically mentioned Svarupa Damodara dasa, Sadaputa dasa, and Madhava dasa in a letter to Dr. Wolf-Rottkay dated October 14, 1976.

Q: If the distance from the earth to the sun is 800,000 miles, how can this be reconciled with modern astronomy?

Contined next post

A: This distance is relative to the plane of Bhu-mandala. The distance from the center of Jambudvipa to the orbit of the sun around Manasottara Mountain is 15,750,000 yojanas according to the dimensions given in the Fifth Canto. This distance lies in the plane of Bhu-mandala and comes to 126,000,000 miles at 8 miles per yojana and 78,750,000 miles at 5 miles per yojana. Since values for the yojana ranging from 5 to 8 miles have been used in India, this distance is compatible with the modern earth-sun distance of 93,000,000 miles.

Q: Using radar and lasers, scientists have recently obtained very accurate estimates of the earth-moon distance. This distance is about 238,000 miles. How do you reconcile this with Vedic calculations?

A: According to the Surya-siddhanta, the distance from the earth globe to the moon is about 258,000 miles (see Section 1.e). This is in reasonable agreement with the modern value.

Q: If the moon is 258,000 miles from the earth globe, then how can it be 100,000 yojanas above the sun? This seems hard to understand, even if the latter distance is relative to the plane of Bhu-mandala.

A: This question is answered in detail in Section 4.b, and the reader should specifically study Tables 8 and 9 in that section. Briefly, we propose the following: The heights of the planets from Bhu-mandala correspond to the maximum heights of the planets from the plane of the ecliptic in the visible solar system. This correspondence is approximate because the Fifth Canto gives the viewpoint of the demigods, whereas in modern astronomy and the jyotisha shastra the viewpoint is that of ordinary humans.

In summary, we propose that the Fifth Canto description of the universe is broadly compatible with what we see. The differences are due to the difference in viewpoint between human beings and demigods. Thus, from the higher-dimensional perspective of a demigod, Bhu-mandala should be directly visible, and the relative positions of Bhu-mandala, the sun, and the moon should appear as described in the Fifth Canto.

Vedic Cosmology Decoding the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam Part 2

Compiled by Mayesa dasa, edited by Gauragopala dasa.

The path of Rahu Part one

The Srimad Bhagavatam 5th canto Ch 24 text 6 says, ‘Below the abodes of the Yaksas and Raksas by a distance of 100 yojanas (800 miles) is the planet earth’.

To understand the mathematical construct found in the 5th Canto we shall begin with the earth. The earth according to modern calculation is 24,902 miles around. How many degrees does a round object have? 360.

24,902 times 360 = 8,964,720. Divide this number by the circumference of the constellations that is 2,031,946,146 (we shall show how to derive this number later) Then multiply by (31,500,000-(80,000+80,000+800)) = then multiply by 360 = 49,775,421.11 this is the orbit of the planets called Siddhaloka, Caranaloka and Vidyadhara loka.

Srimad Bhagavatam Canto 5 Ch 24 text 4 says,

‘Below Rahu by 10,000 yojanas [80,000 miles] are the planets known as Siddhaloka, Caranaloka and Vidyadhara-loka’.

Although these planets are located above Dhruvaloka. Below is meant for the mathematician however, I am working backwards which is more difficult mathematics. Let us begin with Dhruvaloka (we shall explain how to get Dhruvaloka later) and move thru Rahu to Siddhaloka etc and to earth. In this way we are following the texts as they appear in the Bhagavatam.

Dhruvaloka’s orbit is 512,157,669 divide by 360 divide by (31,500,000-80,000)) times 2,031,946,146 (constellations) divided by 18.19 degree of Rahu’s declination) = 5,057,949.548 times 360 = 1,820,861,837 This is Rahu’s orbit through the universe.

The Path of Rahu Part two

In our mathematical formula, which found the orbit of Rahu, we begin from that very same number to discover the path of Siddhaloka, Caranaloka and Vidyadhara-loka. (Of course we do not know if they revolve or are stationary, or what is their exact configuration or are they above or below Dhruvaloka)

1,820,861,837 divide by 360 divide by ((31,500,000-(80,000+80,000)) times 2,031,946,146 divide by 6.588,290,665 = 49,775,421.111 Siddhaloka

49,775,421.111 divide by 360 divide by ((31,500,000-(80,000+80,000+800)) times 2,031,946,146 = 8,964,720 divide by 360 = 24,902 Earth

Continued next post

The Path of Rahu Part three

The formula we are using will not be thoroughly understood until all the pieces are in place. But it uses the circumference of a planet and divides by 360 degrees to get the numbers for one single degree of that circumference.

Then it follows the formula of Bhagavatam using the 31,500,000 figure of the sun’s second axle to subtract or add as the texts indicate. Then we multiply by the constellations. That gives us what is called declination.

We must already know what the declination is for a certain planet and divide by that number. That gives us one single degree of the new planets circumference. So when we multiply by 360 we have the planets circumference (orbit)

There is a little more in understanding the movement of the planets north and south, but we shall learn that as we go. The formula that I have described only works after it has been introduced in the text.

As we proceed and each and every planets orbit is found including its north and south circumferences, things will become clearer. At last we shall draw each planetary orbit and see how they actually move.

The Constellations, The Big Dipper (Seven Sages) and Dhruva

Discovering the number 56,400,000 and how to use it has occurred to me that the mathematical system of the 5th Canto Srimad Bhagavatam could be fashioned on such a system.(see Sun’s Chariot Diagram)

It was finding the mention of such numbers in an Ancient Astronomy book attributed to Hipparchus that I thought I must be on the right track. It was through thousands of wrong calculations that the Lord was kind enough to let me crack the mathematics for one other planet. Then it was a matter of filling in the others. (Not a trivial task)

I am indebted to Danavir Gosvami . I should also thank Dr Nick Lomb, the Curator of Astronomy at the Powerhouse Museum for kindly supplying me the greatest declinations to the main planets.

We have shown how the circumference of the moon is derived. In the Srimad Bhagavatam the next text after discussing the moon is Canto 5 Ch 22 text 11:

There are many stars located 2,000,000 yojanas [1,600,000] above the moon, they are fixed on the wheel of time, and there are twenty-eight important stars, headed by Abhijit. (Abhijit is a star in the constellations.)

Continued next post

Here is the math to derive the constellations

Moon 709,558,416.2 divide by 360 divide by (31,500,000 + 800,000 + 1,600,000) =.058,141,463 times 864,000,000 divide by 8.9 times 360 = 2,031,946,146

The axle of the sun is 31,500,000 and we are to add 1,600,000 miles to it. We have already added 800,000 to it for the moon. We divide by 8.9 because if you are standing on the equator of earth the constellations extend to the north approx 8.9 degrees and to the south approx 8.9 degrees.

Later we shall address Venus, Mercury, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn and the Seven Sages. For now we shall begin with the circumference of the Seven Sages (later we shall show the math how to derive this number) and show how to derive Dhruva loka.

Circumference of the Seven Sages is 1,386,038,221 divide by 360 divide by (31,500,000+800,000+1,600,000+(5 X 1,600,000) + 8,800,000 + 10,400,000 =.063,013,194 times 2,031,946,146 = 128,039,417.2 divide by 90 =1,422,660.192 times 360 = 512,157,669 the circumference of Dhruvaloka.

The number 90 is used as declination for Dhruva as Dhruva is located in the center northern top ward position of the universe. He is in line with Meru at the south.

Earth is out to the side from middle so modern astronomers, not thinking that the universe has a “design” calculate from earth. In this way they calculate the North Star or pole star as 89.1 degrees or something like that. Bhagavatam apparently calculates from the center of the universe, which is Dhruva even though Dhruva may or may not be visible to us.

Because this was once the prevailing view of the universe, in the course of my studies I found many statements alluding to earth being near or in the center of the universe.

In fact, a great amount of information has been handed down through time in various scriptures explain the constellations as being the home of demigods and angels and of the existence of a second earthly dimension below this one.

Gradually over time the factual history of that ancient information slipped away with the advancement of Kali-yuga and the introduction of modern atheistic science and technologies however, it was once held as true by the most erudite philosophers, astronomers and great sages As late as Descarte we find him discussing the constellations as an area of divine beings. Hare Krsna

Another point that needs to be reconciled is whether sun is stationary or earth is stationary or both are moving. The following conversation gives us some insight regarding the Vedic version on this subject

Panca-dravida: What is the Vedic explanation, Srila Prabhupada?

Prabhupada: Vedic explanation is that moon is not going round the earthly planet. [break]

Pusta Krsna: This is very revolutionary thought.

Prabhupada: Hm?

Pusta Krsna: Because children all over the world in schools, they’re taught simply that the moon is going around the earth. They shouldn’t question it.

Prabhupada: Oh, they say, “You should not question”?

Pusta Krsna: No, should not question it. It’s taken as fact.

Prabhupada: My point is: if the moon is going round the earth, beginning from here to there, similarly, the sun is also going around earth, because we see the similar way, it is rising and going that way. So how you can say one is fixed, one is standing? The process, we find the same. How you can say that this is fixed and this is going around? Why is…? If the process is the same, then the result will be the same.

Prabhupada: And the…. And the moon is not seen also for fifteen days in the morning (month?). As a layman, we should say that, as the moon is rising from this side and going to this side, the sun is also rising from this side. So if the moon is moving, the sun is moving.

Panca-dravida: If that’s true, then how does…. What about the changes in the moon’s face? Sometimes…

Prabhupada: True or nontrue, I am layman. I am saying that if the moon is rising from this side and going to this side, so sun is also rising from this side and going to this side. So if the moon is moving, the sun is moving.

Tamala Krsna: Common sense.

Prabhupada: Huh? Yes, I am a layman. Actually sun is moving, but they say fixed up.

Panca-dravida: [break] …moving the same, though, the moon would always appear full, and it goes through changes, or phases.

Prabhupada: Yes. Why it, the moon is…?

Panca-dravida: They say there’s a point called the galactic center of the universe, and everything is moving around that point.

Prabhupada: So what is that center?

Balavanta: Somewhere near the sun. They’ve just imagined it. It’s close to the sun, but not exactly the sun. It’s the center, they say.

Prabhupada: So our Bhagavata says the whole planetary system is moving like this.

Pusta Krsna: Yes.

Prabhupada: Centering the polestar.

Vedic Cosmology Decoding the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam Part 3

Part 1. Calculating the distance to Venus and Mercury

In Srimad Bhagavatam 5th Canto we have seen how to calculate the distance of the sun. In this way the sages have devised a method of calculating other planetary bodies also. Let us review.

We take the sun’s circumference (circular path) as it travels around the equator, which is 756,000,000 divide by 360 divide by 31,500,000, and multiply by sun’s lowest circumference 864,000,000 to get 57,600,000. Both figures 57,600,000 and 756,000,000 are found in Linga and Visnu and Vayu Puranas (Danavir Gosvami has published the cosmological sections of these books)

So that looks like this 756,000,000 divided by 360 divided by 31,500,000 times 864,000,000 equals 57,600,000. 57,600,000 in this case appear to be an approximation. The sun travels 23.7 or 23.8 degrees. 57,600,000 divide by 24 equals 2,400,000 times 360 equals 864,000,000.

Of course this is easy when we already know what is the circumference of a planet. The Srimad Bhagavatam 5th Canto gives us a system for finding the planets. Now the sun is the first planet and the second mentioned is the moon. But how do we understand this?

We must start out the same way 756,000,000 divide by 360. But now the formula says to add 800,000 miles so the formula looks like this 756,000,000 divide by 360 divide by (31,500,000 + 800,000) times 864,000,000 equals 56,173,374.61.

This is the declination in miles of the moon. To get the circumference or circular orbit around the equator of earth divide that number by 28.5, now multiply by 360. The circumference of the orbit of the moon is 709,558,416.2 its declination is 28.5 degrees or 56,173,374.61 miles.

The next planetary body is the constellations. Now we use the last number found to begin our calculation. The math looks like this 709,558,416.2 divide by 360 divide by (31,500,000 + 800,000 + 1,600,000) multiply by 864,000,000 divide by 8.9 multiply by 360

The constellation belts circumference around us at the equator is 2,031,946,146 its declination is 8.9 degrees or 50,234,224.17 miles. Now that the figure for the constellations has been introduced we will use it in the formula rather than the suns circumference of 864,000,000

Continued next post

Note, we can find the declination of a planetary body if we know its circumference around the equator. If its orbit is 105,000,000 miles around us in a circle then divide the circle by 360 degrees and multiply by the declination. So if the declination was 5 the math is as follows 100,000,000 divide by 360 times 5 = 1,388,888.88

That does not mean the planet is on that declination now. This means that 5 degrees is where it travels some time in the future

Part 2. Calculating the distance to Venus and Mercury

The last “planet’s” distance we found was the moon so we begin with the moon The math looks like this 709,558,416.2 divide by 360 divide by (31,500,000 + 800,000 + 1,600,000 + 1,600,000) times (2,031,946,146 divided by 2) = 56,407,843.86 divide by 8.9 =6,337,959.985 divide by 27.8 times 360 = 1,459,772,842 Now divide that number by 2

The circumference of Venus as that planet orbits around earth at the equator is 729,886,420.9

Unlike the moon whose lower and higher declinations bend back towards the earth like a backwards C Venus follows alongside of and in front of and behind the sun. Srimad Bhagavatam Ch 22 5th Canto text 12 says in part – “Sometimes Venus moves behind the sun, sometimes in front of the sun and sometimes along with it.”

To calculate the lowest circumference of Venus we divide by cos (27.8) = 825,121,092.8 to get its highest circumference multiply 729,886,420.9 by cos (27.8) =645,643,642

The circumference of the sun at the equator is 756,000,000 so if Venus is 729,886,420.9 Venus would be in front of the sun however, if Venus is at 729,886,420.9 while the sun is at 648,000,000 the sun is technically closer.

These two planets never occupy the same space and therefore never collide although their paths are similar. We can also note that the Moon is closer, then Venus and then the sun.

Contined next post

Part 3. Calculating the distance to Venus and Mercury

The last planetary distance we found was for Venus. So we begin with that number to find the next planet, Mercury. The math looks like this 729,886,420.9 divide by 360 divide by (31,500,000 + 800,000 + 1,600,000 + 1,600,000 +1,600,000) multiply by (2,031,946,146 divided by 2) = 55,521,484.72 divide by 25.6 times 360 = 780,770,878.9

Now you will notice that the orbit of Mercury is beyond the 756,000,000 of the sun. If we do the math we can subtract these distance from each other and find that Venus is further away from the sun and mercury is closer. Whether or not these planets “circle” the sun I do not know. But we could program the fifth canto math into a computer and find out. Again, as with Venus, mercury is sometimes behind, sometimes with and sometimes in front of the sun.

In Srimad Bhagavatam Ch 22 5th Canto text 12 Mercury is described to be similar to Venus, in that it moves sometimes behind the sun, sometimes in front of the sun and sometimes along with it.

Again we can find the higher and lower declinations by dividing the circumference by cos (25.6) or by multiplying the circumference by cos (25.6) We can also note that Venus is further from the sun than Mercury possibly placing Venus’s orbit around mercury. But it is by plugging the numbers into a computer we shall learn.

Compiled by Mayesa dasa and edited by Gauragopala dasa

Vedic Cosmology Decoding the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam Part 4

Mars, Jupiter and Saturn

Their distances Srimad Bhagavatam 5th Canto I shall be using the symbol / for division and the symbol X for multiplication.

In our previous calculations we have used the 0 degree celestial or planetary orbit around earth’s equator for our equations. Now we must use Venus’s lowest orbit to derive the distance to Mars.

Venus ‘s orbit around equator must be divided by cos (27.8) the math is 729,886,420.9 / cos (27.8) = 825,121,092.8. Now we work the formula as we already have been. The math is as follows

825,121,092.8 / 360 / (31,500,000 + 800,000 + 1,600,000 + 1,600,000 + 1,600,000 + 160,000) X 2,031,946,146 =120,341,776.1 / 27.2 X 360 = 1,592,758,801 Now divide by 2 = 796379400.6 (The number 27.2 is the declination of the planet)

To get Jupiter we must first divide Mars circumference by cos (27.2) to get its extreme of orbit = 895,395,480.1

The math to find Jupiter is as follows 895,395,480.1 / 360 / (31,500,000 + 800,000 + 1,600,000 + =1,600,000 + 1,600,000 + 1,600,000 + 1,600,000) X (2,031,946,146 / 2) / 23.5 X 360 = 960,559,313.1 (The number 23.5 is the declination of the planet)

To get Saturn we use the number 960,559,313.1 without alteration. The math is as follows 960,559,313.1 / 360 / (31,500,000 + 800,000 + 1,600,000 + 1,600,000 + 16,000,000 + 16,000,000 + 1,600,000 = 1,600,000) X (2,031,946,146 / 2) / 22.8 X 360 = 1,021,042,287 (The number 22.8 is the declination of the planet)

[Note to those doing this math, I am going to consolidate the numbers added to the sun’s chariot for easier calculation in following equation]

Now to find the 7 sages (Big Dipper, Ursae Majoris) we must first multiply 1,021,042,287 by 2 = 2,042,084,574 Now we proceed to find the 7 sages. The math looks like this 2,042,084,574 / 360 / (31,500,000 + 2,400,000 + (5 X 1,600,000) + 8,800,000) X 2,031,946,146 / 59.04766825 = 3,850,106.169 X 360 = 1,386,038,221

In this way, through a series of articles we have worked backwards from Canto 5 Ch 24 Text 6 and from Ch 21 forward to meet at the 7 sages and we find that the numbers work. We conclude that this is a mathematical system and that it describes the distance to planetary bodies.

My spiritual master Srila Prabhupada wanted a Vedic planetarium built on this model and if I have contributed to that dream in any way I am grateful.

Compiled by Mayesa dasa and edited by Gauragopala dasa

For those keeping track of this site, I have found a small mathematical error in my computations. It does not however appear to affect the entire formula.

The method I have employed for finding a circumference is mentioned below. So here is the proper method for finding a circumference so that we can get perfect results. It affects four of the planets so now this revised formula will prove more perfect.

Formerly I have written that to get the highest circumference of a planet from its middle you multiply by the cos of the declination, however, this is the proper way to change circumference and make this mathematics final and clearer:

“If I want to know the Sun’s 864,000,000 circumference at 23.5 degrees south I use this formula: 864,000,000 / 360 = 2,400,000 x (360- (23.5 X 1.913553055) = 756,000,000. The number 1.913553055 can always be used even when the declinations or circumferences are different. We shall present a paper summarizing all mathematical formulas at the end of these articles”.

The chariots of the other planets and their distances can be derived from Bhagavatam also, as I have explained. The universe has an edge in every direction where the universe ends and the spiritual world begins.

From Mayesa dasa ACBSP

The universe is far more complex than our gross material senses can reveal. Every religious culture believes in the after life and understanding this in completely explained in the Srimad Bhagavatam.

Material science with there gross material means, will never understand that there are heavenly and hellish planets all around us that can only be realised by pious and impious actions and NOT through space probes, the Hubble Telescope and the Large Hadron Collider.

Vedic Cosmology is real and absolute; it sees all dimensional realities beyond the single limited dimension modern material science sees and therefore is more complete, Srila Prabhupada has said such explanations are to be taken literally as the true perceptive of the cosmos, keep this in mind when reading the ALL the Srimad Bhagavatam

Vedic Cosmology Decoding the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam, Part 5

Finding distance, declination and movement of the planets in the Surya Siddhanta.

By Mayesa dasa edited by Gauragopala dasa

Sunrise to sunset is the route the Sun Planet takes in his giant golden chariot harnessed to seven horses. The chariot of the Sun-god (Surya), worshiped by the words om bhur bhuva svah, travels at a speed of 3,400,800 yojanas (27,206,400 miles) in a muhurta (a muhurta equals approximately 48 minutes).

Part One. Using the formulas in the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam and the Surya Siddhanta in a balanced way for better understanding of Planet distances

We have shown how the Srimad Bhagavatam 5th Canto has a formula for finding the planets. Now we shall turn to Surya Siddhanta for the same information. In this way, we shall be able to confirm or correct our understanding of the formula in 5th Canto.

All the following numbers are given in various places in the Surya Siddhanta.

In Chapter 12 of Surya Siddhanta we find a formula. It is said there to “multiply the orbit of the sun by 60” and “multiply the revolutions of the moon in a kalpa” (It is important to know that when a planet moves through its cycle it has an orbit that is permanent and it has an orbit that is changing. When we subtract the unchanging orbit from the greatest circumference we are left with the planet’s “daily movement”.)

Next the text reads, “This orbit divided by the respective orbits of the planets in a kalpa gives the respective orbits of the planets. Dividing these orbits by the number of terrestrial days gives the respective movements of the planets.”

Let us do this much for the Sun planet.

(60 X 4,331,500 X 57,753,336) / 4,320,000 = 34,744,246,510 / (1,577,917,828 / 4,320,000) = 9,512,228.22.

We already have the daily movement of the planet, it is 34,744,246,510 X 2 X Pi = 218,304,539,200. This is too much, for our figure in Srimad Bhagavatam 5th Canto, but there is a reason for this in the mathematics of Surya Siddhanta.

Now the formula reads “Multiply daily motion by orbit of moon and divide by planet’s own orbit”. So, 9,512,228.22 X 324,000 / 4,331,500 = 1,423,046.032 (1,423,046.032 / 23.5) = 60,555.1513 / 280.1257085 = 216.1713454. (Surya Siddhanta does not specifically give this formula but it mentions, “This will yield their daily motions in kalaas” We have not found a definition for kalaa so we have had to apply logic.

Continued next post

Now we have declination and movement. The Earth planet at 23.5 degrees north is 28,012.57085 and south it is 21,617.13454. Of course, the Earth is never really bigger than 24,902 but by this formula we can understand the “movement” from the side of a planet.

We know it goes around the Earth, but when is it close and when is it far away? This formula cleverly paints the picture for us. Without this calculation we would not know the north and south movement of the planets. It is not found in Srimad Bhagavatam as far as we can determine (with the exception of the Sun planet).

Part Two. The formulas in Surya Siddhanta and the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam working together to establish Planetary Distances

In the first part of the formula we have found the number 34,744,246,510. Because we already know this is different than what we get in the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam, we shall subtract the smaller number (Srimad Bhagavatam) from the greater (Surya Siddhanta) and that gives us 366,778.8022.

We are bothering with this because, unlike the numbers in the rest of the formulas, this number is a couple of decimal points too large. We will correct it for the decimal points and still we will utilize both the original number from Surya Siddhanta and the number we got by subtraction in the final formula.

So we think that starting with the Sun, Sunday; Moon, Monday; Mars, Tuesday; Mercury, Wednesday; Jupiter, Thursday; Venus, Friday; Saturn, Saturday, we are being given another part of the formula without it being directly said in the text.

Now multiply both these numbers by 2 and by Pi and we utilize them in the final formula in Ch. 12 of Surya Siddhanta. (218,304,539.2 X (2,304,539.181 / Pi)) / 2,304,539.181 = 69,488,493.03 – (2,304,539.181 / Pi) = 68,754,935.42 / 2 = 34,377,467.71.

When we multiply by 2 and by Pi we have an exact match to Srimad Bhagavatam to the decimal point. 34,377,467.71 X 2 X Pi = 216,000,000. Now 864,000,000 – 216,000,000 = 648,000,000.

Continued next post

The significance of the number 2,304,539.181 is that the Earth is situated on an invisible circumference away from the center of the universe. Meru and Dhruva are south and north respectively. Earth planet is not situated in the center.

If you draw a circle in front of you and place a penny to the right of center, though the circle is a circle, it will not appear to be a circle to the penny, it will appear to act as an ellipse, as the modern scientists say the planetary orbits behave.

When we look into space it appears we see elliptical trajectories or galaxies. Hold a quarter in your hand straight on – it is a circle. Turn it a little to the side, what do you see? An ellipse. Has the circle changed?

Once this was no longer understood, mathematicians and scientists had to create a different explanation to account for planetary movements.

This topic is so complex, there is still much more to be known and understood, especially the position, size and distance of the Moon according to sastra. This is what Srila Prabhupada says –

Srimad Bhagavatam 8.10.38 Purport

“Apparently, therefore, as stated elsewhere in Srimad-Bhagavatam, the sun, not the moon, is the planet nearest the earth. We have already discussed this point in many places. The sun is first, then the moon, then Mars, Jupiter and so on.

The sun is supposed to be 93,000,000 miles above the surface of the earth, and from the Srimad-Bhagavatam we understand that the moon is 1,600,000 miles above the sun. Therefore the distance between the earth and the moon would be about 95,000,000 miles. So if a space capsule were traveling at the speed of 18,000 miles per hour, how could it reach the moon in four days? At that speed, going to the moon would take at least seven months. That a space capsule on a moon excursion has reached the moon in four days is therefore impossible.

According to Mayesa dasa, the Moon is very large and is between 95,000,000 to a 100,000,000 miles from Earth. Of course this creates a dilemma when taking into account what the material scientists are saying however, the only conclusion is devotees except the conclusions of sastra over science gathered with the faulty material senses. Maybe the demigods are pulling the wool over the material scientists eyes who makes them see a limited view of the universe only. The fact is, modern technology is not seeing the full picture with their limited gross material vision, telescopes and space probes.

Question – If Bhu-mandala resembles lotus flower with seven petals and in Jambudvipa situates Earth planet, does this means Earth is round and does not have lotus petal form? Only Jambudvipa is one petal of the seven of Bhumandala, isn’t it? But Earth planet is round as we know it these days, no?

Answer –

The earth planet is round.And if you study my calculations (mathematical from above posts) we get from Srimad Bhagavatam and Surya Siddhanta, you will find that these two books use the earth in the calculations.It’s size and sphere-shape was known in these books. Meru is below earth because sastra says it always has the sunlight on its top. Earth planet has sun and main stars going around its middle. Earth is located above Meru. That is all I wish to say at this time. Still working the numbers. Still more calculations to come

From Mayesa dasa ACBSP

Facing the challenges of modern science vs Srimad Bhagavatam Cosmology in the 21st Century

It’s maybe be hard for some aspiring devotees to accept all the sastras or scriptures dealing with cosmology as literal fact in the face of modern science which in itself has changed so much since the 17th Century and has continued to transform so much even in the last 40 years since Srila Prabhupada was physically here.

Some have asked, if Srila Prabhupada were here today, would he have a different opinion on some issues regarding the material scientist? For example, Srila Prabhupada said 40 years ago that all space flight endeavors would end in failure? Would his opinion change today on the Moon landings in the face of SO much evidence, seeing that so many countries are supposedly sending probes there? And what about the success, not failure, of vehicles moving around on Mars today as many of us are inclined to believe as fact? I’m bringing this up because so many devotees will ask these questions and will choose to not follow blindly while searching for answers.

Regardless of these reservations, one thing is certain, Srila Prabhupada today would definitely NOT change his opinion on sastric conclusions, Therefore his understanding of the Sun and moons distances and the fact the Sun orbits Meru will never change because it is sastric fact regardless of what the material scientists speculate with their imperfect senses.

So what is the ultimate answer to the conclusions of modern science? As devotees and aspiring devotees, we have to understand the deep meanings of sastric Cosmology and learn to accept only that version because the material scientists are not seeing the subtle material energy, as well as the subtle material bodily vessels of living entities that exist there on other planets, including the Sun. The material scientists are also only seeing the gross material energy, which is very limited, they are not seeing the full picture of the material universe described in the Srimad Bhagavatam.

Therefore, they only see the limited gross material energy within the material universe, they are not seeing so many subtle worlds including the Sun chariot with their telescopes and probes, nor the living entities on the Sun, moon and other planets, they are not seeing the demigod inhabitants or even the hellish planets and their inhabitants, they are restricted in everyway and everywhere by their gross material senses. Hare Krsna

Vedic Cosmology Decoding the 5th Canto of Srimad Bhagavatam, Part 6

By Mayesa das edited by Gauragopala dasa

Part One Finding the Moon in Surya Siddhanta

The formula for finding the planets in the Surya Siddhanta cannot be employed for the moon. This is so because all the planets are found taking help of the number 324,000 and 57,753,336 which are for the moon. If we try to derive the moon from this formula the numbers cancel each other out.

Therefore the Surya Siddhanta gives us two separate numbers for the moon. Still our numbers will be canceled out applying them to the formula as is. So we must surmise that these numbers are to be used differently.

First let us set out some specifics about the planetary movements, which we need to know.

1) The sun planet revolves around us in 24 hours 360 degrees, the other planets do not do this. For example the moon moves 346.823 degrees daily (This creates what is called retrograde movement.) At eight o’clock tonight you will see the moon over your head but tomorrow night it will not be there it will be towards the east. Each planet has its specific orbit time.

2) The circumferences, which we use in the formulas, are specific for the planets we are finding but we may also have to take into account the degree of movement such as 360 or 346.823. We shall address this later.

3) The figures (324,000, 4,331,500 etc) in Surya Siddhanta are mathematical constructs. They are to be used as they are. Mathematical constructs means – You have the earth planet, which is 24,902 miles in circumference. When the sun is at 23.5 degrees, the earth at that degree if you were to draw a line from the center of the earth to the sun and than find the circumference (circle on earths surface) at that degree parallel with the circumference 24,902 you do some math.

24,902 / 360 = 69.172. Therefore 69.172 X ((360- (23.5 X 1.91355305500 = 21,791.42915

Now how do we relate the earth circumferences to planetary movements? That is where Mathematical constructs come in

4) The sun does not always move 23.5 degrees nor the moon always move 28.5 or 28.6 but for the purpose of Srimad Bhagavatam and Surya Siddhanta formulas, some degree must be selected in order to derive the solution (We are making all attempts to use the degrees the formulas themselves reveal)

It is our hope that by perfecting one system we can correct any mistakes in the other system that we have made inadvertently.

Continued next post

Part Two. Finding the Moon in Surya Siddhanta

Morning Walk December 17, 1973 Los Angeles, California

Srila Prabhupada: “In Bhagavatam there is regular calculation what is the distance from one planet to another”.

The two numbers given for the moon are 324,000 and 38,328,484 In the formulas for the other planets we use 324,000 but we shall now use the other number provided in Surya Siddhanta 60 X 38,328,484 X 57,753,336 / (107,459,665.6 /2 / pi) X 2) = 3,882,883,458 / 28.5 / 69.172 = 1,969,641.283. The number 107,459,665.6 is the daily movement of the moon. The number 1,969,641.283 is a single degree of the moon’s circumference around the equator of earth. This is called apsis. The text in Surya Siddhanta reads “apsis” 1,969,641.283 X 360 = 709,070,861.7

This is exactly the number we found in Srimad Bhagavatam formula. It appears we can derive more numbers but these are sufficient to give us the moon. 709,070,861.1 – 107,459,665.6 = 601,611,195.5

What we learn is that the moon is traveling a great distance from earth planet. This indicates that the earth and moon are not revolving around each other in a synchronized orbit as they circle the sun, as modern science takes for granted. Rather as the sun circles earth planet, so too does the moon. In order to circle the sun with moon and earth in a synchronized orbit around each other, the moon must necessarily be a small object. But these numbers reveal the moon as a large object at a great distance.

Bhagavad-gita as it is Chapter 11 txt 19 – ‘You are without origin, middle or end. Your glory is unlimited. You have numberless arms, and the sun and moon are Your eyes. I see You with blazing fire coming forth from Your mouth, burning this entire universe by Your own radiance’.

Part Three Finding the Moon in Surya Siddhanta

It is also possible that by manipulating these numbers we can find for the moon at 18.28 degrees that is the moons shortest declination. The moon is moving up and down north and south back to zero twice in a month. Sometimes it is at various degrees before it reverses direction, its shortest travel is 18.28 degrees.

We have said the moon moves 346.823 degrees around earth planet at the same time it is moving north and south. (60 X 346.8236479) = 20,809.41887 X (57,753,336 X 38,328,484) / 68,925,006.57 / 2 = (18.28 squared) Again we have used the special number for the moon 38,328,484. The number of miles the moon passes from 0 degrees to 18.28 degrees is 68,925,006.57