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Comments Posted By Sugriva das

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Thank you Devaki Mataji!

Kaunteya states

Yes; ‚Äúthe qualification has to be there‚ÄĚ (which is a principle for both men and women), who could disagree on this?

Does this mean that women in the past didn’t rise to the high standards of devotional service like our ISKCON women? That women like Pishima what to speak of Kunti, Draupadi, and Devahuti were only kanisthas and not on the level of our ISKCON women and hence were not qualified to be FDG. Or, were there some other reasons that mahabhagavatas in female bodies didn’t take up the service of being a diksha guru?

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 02.12.2013 @ 10:53

Some Evidence Regarding Education and Guruship for Vaishnavis

Keshava Krsna said:

Due to general male weakness, females of all ages are often abused under the guise of so-called tradition and protection. World and News statistics reveal how males are hardly living up to protection status. If this tide continues, people will start to lose faith in the male species. It is already happening.

When weakened males demand a return to, or a creation of male-dominated strictures in the face of suspicion and doubt, it is for males to prove their capabilities first. And yet we speak optimistically of a coming Golden Age.

I find your statement here to be offensive and absurd. You have generalized that all men have become weak and abuse women. Does that apply to you as well? Are you speaking about yourself? Who are you speaking about? The real fact of the matter is that as sastras tell us since time immemorial there have always been good men and bad men and that women need to be protected from bad men (and themselves) by good men.

Your words are like a mangina reading from a feminist script and that I just cannot accept. If you believe it then you are also one of those weak men so why should we listen to you. Your whole attitude contributes to an adversarial attitude between men and women as you can see by my reaction. From the way you write men are all abusive, rapist, monsters. What kind of effect does that have on women? And what kind of man would want to be associated with women who have been affected by such rhetoric?

In general I find the the members of ISKCON are several years behind the curve on these issues. In the mundane world there is already much greater awareness of the pernicious effects of feminism and there is a growing backlash to it. While the rest of the world has grown wary of the social disease called feminism we in ISKCON are more than willing to drink the “purple kool-aid.”

Also please explain to me how it is that the pernicious effects of Kali yuga are gender specific and only affects men but not women. You need to go back and read SB 12 canto about what it does to women.

This desire for so called equality is a by product of the failed Marxist doctrine of which modern feminism is definitely and on off spring and like Marxism it will self destruct and that self destruction will take many down with it. This desire for equality is a manifestation of our envy of Krsna and wanting to be equal to Him.

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 17.01.2013 @ 06:44

Women Gurus In Kali Yuga?

@ Keshava Krsna Prabhu #9

You typed:

‚ÄúThat reference was written in early 1969. During those times, as Govinda Mataji can attest, Iskcon was still in the ‚Äėclose family‚Äô mode. Indeed, Govinda Mataji was Srila Prabhupada‚Äôs secretary for a while. Three disciple couples were to travel to London to set Iskcon history. Can we see why Srila Prabhupada was optimistic? (Of course he always was) ‚ÄúBy 1975‚Ķ‚ÄĚ he wanted Bhaktivedanta namesakes. Did things happen this way? No.‚ÄĚ

Srila Prabhupada saw that many of disciples had fallen down and by 1977 he ordered that Varnashrama Dharma was to implemented and started specifically in ISKCON (Feb 14, 1997 Mayapura‚ÄĒVarnashrama Dharma conversation)

It should also be noted that Srila Prabhupada penned the Suniti could not be a diksha guru purport in the 4th canto in 1974, several years after that letter to Hamsadutta.

Thus his later instruction in 1974 supersedes that of 1969.

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 06.12.2012 @ 19:35

A Tale of Two Zodiacs

Dear Antardvipa Prabhu,

Hare Krsna. I wanted to thank you and also Shyamasundara Prabhu for your very nice explanation it is by far much more authoritative and convincing than that of the antagonist. After reading your explanation Vrajakishore’s text by comparison was nebulous at best, disorganized, simplistic and unscientific. I also found his comments to be of the hairsplitting variety and unable in any way to nullify your presentation. In fact they made your case even stronger.

Again I thank both you and Shyamasundara Prabhu for your efforts to enlighten us and remove the doubts created by others.

yhs
Sugriva das

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 09.11.2012 @ 06:05

The 12 Signs of The Zodiac

Dear Vraja Kishore Prabhu,
In #23 you wrote:

‚ÄúThe book itself repeats a well known fact that Bhaktisiddhanta was not a Jataka, ever. The topic under discussion here is Jataka Jyotisha. Therefore even once we know confidently what Bhaktisiddhanta‚Äôs opinion on the definition of the zodiac starting point; still we have to take that point into careful consideration.‚ÄĚ

It appears to me that you are implying that astronomy is dependent on astrology and not the other way around. How is that? Without astronomy there is no astrology. What am I missing here? Please clarify, you seem to be saying even if as Vedic astronomer Srila Bhaktisiddhanta favored sidereal zodiac then this would still not be sufficient for you unless he were an astrologer as well. If he was not an astrologer then it would as you say require ‚Äúcareful consideration.‚ÄĚ Why?

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 14.09.2012 @ 06:30

Brihaspati in the Horoscopes of Devotees

part 2

Then on the other extreme are those who come into astrology from the sciences but have no sadhana. (This is especially common in India.) They get caught up in mathematical analysis without developed intuition via spiritual practices. This type is less prevalent than the former. If they were to practice a regular sadhana of japa and other basic principles of Bhakti yoga then they have good potential for being excellent astrologers. And, while it is possible for anyone to take up the sadhana of bhakti yoga, it is not really possible for the mathematically challenged to become good mathematicians.

The conflict that you have seen in the comments in this and other jyotish related articles in the last few months has been (IMHO) between those who want jyotish to be presented as a real Vedic science with the required balance of intellectual rigor and spiritual sadhana versus the ‚ÄúPop‚ÄĚ presentation of jyotish which tarnishes the subject and makes it an object of ridicule as you and others have commented.

Akruranatha said:

I am glad to know that the devotees who are taking up this field of Vedic knowledge are doing so responsibly and thoughtfully. I really did mean what I said about encouraging you to write articles about it.

Unfortunately that is not the case for as we have seen there are the serious students who want to follow the actual tradition and the others.

I am only a student of jyotisa it would be better if someone like Shyamasundara Prabhu who has dedicated his whole life to this science would write. Much of what I have written above is from him and can be found on his site at:

http://www.shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/what_is_jyotish/philosophy_of_jyotish_1.html

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 14.04.2010 @ 05:11

Akruranatha said:

Astrology also suffers under a stigma or reputation of being not actually scientific, full of superstition and lore to lure gullible people.

Astrology is a great science that has been degraded for various reasons. Now a days many people think that they are astrologers if they can punch the birth data into their computer program but would be lost without their computers being unable to do the basic math required to draw up a chart.

In the past to be a qualified astrologer in India required proficiency in Sanskrit, mathematics and astronomy before one could even study jyotish texts. So you can imagine that this would eliminate most people from the study because they would not be intelligent enough to master the pre-requisites. These pre-requisites would give the student a razor sharp mind and keen intellect required to deal with jyotish the hetu sastra dealing with cause and effect. Make no mistake about it jyotish is a super-science, it is a multi-disciplinary study and the most complicated of all material sciences. But because it is a super-science, such intellectual training though necessary is not sufficient. Because they were brahmanas they also studied sastra, practiced tapasya, chanted japa, meditation, yoga etc all of which are important to increase the person’s intuition making them sensitive to the message of param atma. So this combination of intellectual rigor and refined intuition resulted in master astrologers. Both sides are important if one is missing then it doesn’t work.

Unfortunately the introduction of calculation aids such as ephemerides and lately computers has drastically lowered the bar to the point that the mathematically challenged take up astrology after reading a few books. Therefore disrupting the necessary balance of rigor and logic on one side and spiritually developed intuition on the other. Their thinking is fuzzy and characterized by reliance on their so-called ‚Äúpsychic abilities,‚ÄĚ lack of real depth of understanding of the subject, no intellectual rigor and a shallow approach. They are ‚Äúpop‚ÄĚ astrologers with no scientific training.

continued..

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 14.04.2010 @ 05:08

Regarding text 54

I am sincerely interested in the philosophical issue raised by Sugriva about whether Brhaspati is like a barometer (i.e., a predictor, not a causal agent).

I got it and a lot more from a Jyotish seminar that Shyamasundara Prabhu gave in the Soho temple last year. I downloaded it from his website.

You should know that Brhaspati is only one of many synonyms for the planet Jupiter. He is also called Jiva, Angirasa, Suraguru, Mantri, Vachaspati, Arya, Suri and Vagisa. (Hora Sara chapter 2) Angirasa and Brhaspati are two different people though related to each other. Similarly Venus has multiple names such as Sukra, Bhrigu, Asphujit, Sita, Usana, and Kavi. Again Brghu and Sukra are not the same person.

In Sanskrit all the planets have multiple names. So simply taking the name Brihaspati and identifying the planet as the person will get you in trouble. Rather Jupiter’s qualities would best be described to be like Brhaspati when Jupiter is manifesting his best qualities. In other words the planet is named according to articles that share similar symptoms. Also every planet has a huge portfolio of things that it represents in the case of Jupiter it represents Brhaspati and persons like him, as well as people of great knowledge (Vachaspati), power of speech (Vagisa), sattva guna, and wise minister (Mantri). He also represents the liver, and fat in the human body. So it is not that Jupiter is fat or your liver or even the deva guru Brhaspati, but rather he represents such things. One should not be confused in thinking that because one of many synonyms for the planet is Brhaspati that he is actually the person Brhaspati, by that reasoning he would also be Angirasa who is a different person altogether. There is a personality ruling the planet Jupiter who is described in sastra and you will often see pictures of him along with the other navagrahas but as far as I know that person is not Brhaspati or Angirasa.

The actual person controlling Jupiter/Brhaspati/Guru/Angirasa is Vamanadeva and He is supremely independent.

I hope this helps.

As for your other comments I have been traveling and don’t always have time for such things.

Yhs
SGd

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 10.04.2010 @ 21:21

Patita Pavana said:

When I met BV Raman in his office in the seventies, we discussed Prabhupada’s horoscope as Dhanush lagna. After that his journal printed articles to this effect, even while his daughter Smt Gayatri Vasudeva was the Editor. Dhanush lagna is accepted by every great (in my opinion) astrologer of India including my own teacher Shri Pandit Vijai Ranamukhadevaji who proved this point to me in 1973-4 From my point of view, there is very little room for debate on this issue.

I asked for proof that BV Raman made these statements, this is not proof. If he indeed published such articles then cite them. BV. Raman also published Lord Caitanya’s chart in Notable Horoscopes in chapter 14 with a Libra lagna not Simha lagna as is found in the Caitanya Caritamrta and universally accepted in the Gaudiya world including even by yourself. How will you reconcile this conundrum? That the person you claim says Prabhupada had a Dhanus lagna also wrongly claims that Mahaprabhu has a Tula lagna. This is a point that K.N. also mentioned when he did Mahaprabhu’s chart that BV Raman got it wrong. There was never any mention by KN Rao regarding BV Raman’s reading of Prabhupada’s chart, if BV Raman had made any comment on Prabhupada’s chart then K.N. Rao would have mentioned it as he was a long time contributor to BV Raman’s magazine.

I see that you have closed your mind on this subject and no matter that even Srila Prabhupada himself directly said, and it is recorded for posterity, that the Makara lagna chart prepared by Ojha was accurate whereas those with Dhanur were not has no effect on you. So if you will not even accept the words of Srila Prabhupada then you are truly impervious to light, a card carrying example of scissor’s philosophy.

You may think I have something against you. I do not. I am just interested in the subject being properly presented then the community of devotees will be benefited.

SGd

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 04.04.2010 @ 12:17

Patita Pavana said:

Discussions regarding the horoscopes of living ISKCON sannyasis in public is a violation of all Vaishnava ethics and etiquette.. In my opinion, His Holiness Indradyumna Maharaja‚ÄĚ

This is a cop out. First of all I do not know Maharaja‚Äôs horoscope, what to speak of discussing it, but I do happen to know his year of birth and know that Jupiter was debilitated at that time and remained so for about a year. I was commenting on your (or who ever wrote that article) overly simplistic presentation of a very complex subject. And how you run away for difficult questions by citing etiquette, as was the case with comment #1 when in actuality you do not have an answer to the question. As if Jupiter is the only planet capable of showing spiritual life in a person‚Äôs chart. By your one-dimensional understanding every year when Jupiter is debilitated we would expect that demons are born and no devotees. Yet we find many powerful devotees born during those times. And every year when Jupiter is exalted in Cancer we would expect to find many devotees as 25% of the population will have Brihapati either in the 1st, 3rd, 5th or 9th but this is not the case. Because we also find religious hypocrites born when Guru is in his own sign or otherwise seemingly powerful according to your article. So there is a lot more at work than simply Brhaspati. That is why I said your presentation of the subject focusing only on Jupiter as all good, never problematic, and emblematic of Bhakti — is one dimensional and I stand by that. It is the equivalent of Sun sign astrology except that instead of the Sun you substituted Jupiter. Einstein once said ‚Äúthat if you really know a subject then you can explain it even to a child.‚ÄĚ Considering that you could not explain the factors identifying the spiritual dimension in a person‚Äôs chart to adults what to speak of children then‚Ķ

SGd

Comment Posted By Sugriva das On 04.04.2010 @ 12:13


 


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