{"id":2703,"date":"2007-01-17T23:22:44","date_gmt":"2007-01-17T22:22:44","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/?p=2703"},"modified":"2007-01-18T09:09:53","modified_gmt":"2007-01-18T08:09:53","slug":"interview-with-ksudhi-prabhu","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/?p=2703","title":{"rendered":"Interview with Ksudhi Prabhu"},"content":{"rendered":"

Those Who Have Life Can Preach
\nAn Interview with Ksudhi Dasa by Amrita Gopala Dasi
\n(Congregational Development Ministry www.namahatta.org<\/a>)<\/p>\n

Ksudhi dasa, initiated by ISKCON Founder-Acarya Srila Prabhupada in 1970, is known for his pioneering spirit. A dedicated and caring preacher, Ksudhi Prabhu is credited with starting the South African yatra back in 1972. Presently he lives in Laguna Beach, California and is engaged in Bhakti-vriksha propagation. In this interview, done in Sri Mayapur Dhama, Ksudhi Prabhu speaks about the essential elements of congregational preaching. <\/p>\n

Amrita Gopala Dasi: Bhakti-vriksha preaching is still in the pioneering stages. What is the value of using the model to spread the Hare Krishna movement?<\/p>\n

Ksudhi dasa: In some places, things expand quickly; in other places it takes more time. To train people how to do devotional service on their own\u2014as the Bhakti-vriksha model promotes\u2014allows everyone to be responsible even at the early stages of their Krishna consciousness. Sometimes the situation is that people come to the temple over a long period of time, but they are not given any responsibility. But with Bhakti-vriksha, you don\u2019t wait for a year to ask people to chant 16 rounds, but you propose that everyone chant one round together.<\/p>\n

AGD: Have you found the \u201cEach-One-Teach-One\u201d method to be effective?<\/p>\n

KD: Teaching means to show people according to their level. Start with the basics: explain what prasada is; show them where the sloka is on the page. The teacher must be able to relate to the student. For example, if Jayapataka Swami says to a person, \u201cYou shouldn\u2019t smoke, its not good,\u201d coming from him, a sannyasi, it wouldn\u2019t have the same impact. It has more meaning coming from someone who\u2019s been there. \u201cHey, you know, I couldn\u2019t give up smoking for twenty years, but as soon as I started chanting four rounds of Hare Krishna, I could leave cigarettes.\u201d That shared experience has great value. That the teacher has changed his behavior in the recent past impacts the new person. The teacher is convincing the student that by taking shelter of Krishna, the results are positive. Sometimes we forget the power of life experience and we think, \u201cOh, let me send him to the swami and he\u2019ll explain everything.\u201d It\u2019s true that the swamis and senior, long-time devotees can give so much inspiration, and it\u2019s also true that someone who has come more recently to Krishna consciousness can share and inspire people to change their behavior and habits.
\nNowadays, devotees beg, \u201cGive me mercy!\u201d But in the old days, devotees used to ask, \u201cHow can I get mercy?\u201d Like Krishna says in Bhagavad-gita:<\/p>\n

ya ida\u00e0 parama\u00e0 guhya\u00e0
\nmad-bhakte\u00f1v abhidh\u00e4syati
\nbhakti\u00e0 mayi par\u00e4\u00e0 k\u00e5tv\u00e4
\nm\u00e4m evai\u00f1yaty asa\u00e0\u00e7aya\u00f9<\/p>\n

\u201cFor one who explains this supreme secret to the devotees, pure devotional service is guaranteed, and at the end he will come back to Me\u201d (18.68). We get more mercy when we go out and preach. Teach someone how to chant a round. Give someone a book\u2014you don\u2019t need to be able to quote the entire Sanskrit before you can sell one. You do need to know a little bit, but not everything. <\/p>\n

AGD: Speaking about sharing relationships, have the devotees in Bhakti-vriksha groups formed close bonds?<\/p>\n

KD: We know the solution is Krishna consciousness, but sometimes we don\u2019t know what a person\u2019s problem is. That\u2019s the first thing one must know if he or she is going to help someone\u2014what their problem is. That\u2019s why making friends with people is so important. Trust will come from that friendship. People don\u2019t care how much you know; they want to know how much you care. We can\u2019t offer the solution\u2014Krishna consciousness\u2014unless we know what\u2019s going on in that person\u2019s life. \u201cYou should so this, you should do that,\u201d doesn\u2019t work.
\nIf the facilitator can create a mood of trust and generate a space for sharing, then people will open up and reveal what is close to them. The facilitator must be able to share his own experiences: \u201cWhen I had this problem, I started chanting more and taking shelter of Krishna and it helped me.\u201d We demonstrate the applicability, the practicality of Krishna consciousness. <\/p>\n

AGD: Have you experienced that the devotees engaged in Bhakti-vriksha advance very quickly?<\/p>\n

KD: It\u2019s a matter of dedication. When one goes to the temple, there may be a tendency to look at it like a spectator sport. One can just stand back and observe. But with Bhakti-vriksha and Nama-hatta groups, it\u2019s important to establish commitment. Like if a person comes to three meetings out of five, and then frequently comes late, it will be a disturbance. The Bhakti-vriksha Manual advises that the meetings start on time, and this is an essential rule to follow. The latecomers shouldn\u2019t be rewarded while the people who come on time get punished.<\/p>\n

AGD: A variety of people with different backgrounds and professions comprise the congregation. This culture, having to open up to a group, do people find it alien?<\/p>\n

KD: People generally seem to prefer the Nama-hatta setting because they don\u2019t have to share as much, or give as much. They can come to hear a swami give a talk, but they can remain in the background. <\/p>\n

AGD: What are some strategies to attract people to join Bhakti-vriksha?<\/p>\n

KD: The method that I use today comes from my experience in South Africa when I was preaching there alone. Instead of waiting for people to help me, I had to canvass and engage those people who I found to be willing to help out. You have to preach to those people who are there. Engage people. Rather than say, \u201cI\u2019m going to do this and you\u2019re going to watch me,\u201d have people assist.
\nAn ideal situation would be to have many Bhakti-vriksha groups rather than a few small ones. Say in a city there are 50 groups\u2014there would be a meeting everyday for people to go to once or twice a week. Of course, the advantage of Bhakti-vriksha is that it is small and local. But getting started is difficult because the logistics are narrower. If someone can\u2019t make it on Thursdays, for example, you may lose that person. But if there are several groups in a city, there are options and alternatives. There are so many advantages to expanding, and that\u2019s what you generally don\u2019t find with Nama-hatta. Different groups can be orientated towards different things; membership can be tailored to particular interests. There can be a groups just for ladies, and groups of people who share a common profession. <\/p>\n

AGD: One focus of Bhakti-vriksha is preaching and bringing new people in. How are you cultivating the preaching spirit in your group?<\/p>\n

KD: This is the toughest thing. I haven\u2019t been able to cultivate it to the level I would like. One difficulty is that people move away frequently. They go away to college, or they get new jobs. I do make a point to try and keep in touch, and some people have moved to places where they can attend Bhakti-vriksha or go to a nearby temple. And then there are politics. One member of our group was creating a disturbance, and I found out that some community members didn\u2019t want to come to our meetings because this guy was involved. He was a notorious cheater. And in the Bhakti-vriksha group, because it\u2019s intimate and small, to have this type of person involved is detrimental. It reflects badly in the minds of new people. How will they feel about the facilitator and about devotees? About Krishna consciousness? <\/p>\n

AGD: When Srila Prabhupada was pioneering the Krishna consciousness movement, he dealt with so many different kinds of characters and natures. In your Bhakti-vriksha groups, how are you connecting people with Srila Prabhupada? <\/p>\n

KD: Because we\u2019re studying Srila Prabhupada\u2019s books, that connection is developed. The whole thing is based on how to apply the teachings in Srila Prabhupada\u2019s books. If one is a temple devotee, the Deities are there, devotee association is there, being Krishna conscious isn\u2019t such a challenge. But congregation members have to associate with all kinds of people, so learning how to apply the teachings of Lord Krishna is an important part of Bhakti-vriksha. The practical aspects must be learned: \u201cWho can I speak to? Who do I avoid completely?\u201d
\nOne important lesson to learn from Srila Prabhupada and his followers is how to encourage people. Devotees such as Jayapataka Swami and Kadamba Kanana Maharaja are expert in treating people with care. Getting people to take part and play a role\u2014that is the duty of the facilitator. Let people know about the variety of activities in Krishna consciousness. There is something for everyone in Krishna consciousness. Some people are inclined towards preaching, others toward puja and Deity worship. It\u2019s a matter of encouraging people to find their place. Having people just come and watch isn\u2019t enough, but at the same time, it\u2019s rare that a person will instantly give up everything and become a devotee overnight.
\nSometimes we limit the options by presenting them too narrowly. \u201cYou can have a glass of water or a fifteen-course feast. Nothing in between.\u201d We are a preaching movement, but not everyone is ready or willing to distribute books at the airport. In other words, it\u2019s not an \u201call or nothing\u201d situation. Everyone can be encouraged to do a little, and for those who can do a lot, that encouragement will naturally be there. The main factor is consistency. Srila Prabhupada said it\u2019s better to do something simple than to be inactive. Our movement will benefit by developing the kind of culture where people are trained to be responsible. Maybe a person doesn\u2019t have the capacity to save the whole world, but their efforts should be appreciated.
\nThe simplicity of Bhakti-vriksha is very attractive: a few people come together and have kirtana and study the philosophy and learn how to apply it. The group members get a taste and share it with others. Getting people to work together, not as inimical competitors, but as friendly allies with a shared purpose\u2014these are the fruits and flowers of Bhakti-vriksha. Maybe you don\u2019t have as many people coming as you would like, but work with what you have. Like in kirtana: one is blessed to be able to play mridanga like an expert, but another can only clap his hands. But still the kirtana is there, going on. <\/p>\n

For more discussions on congregational development: www.namahatta.org<\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

\"HareBy Amrita Gopala Dasi<\/strong><\/p>\n

Ksudhi dasa, initiated by ISKCON Founder-Acarya Srila Prabhupada in 1970, is known for his pioneering spirit. A dedicated and caring preacher, Ksudhi Prabhu is credited with starting the South African yatra back in 1972. Presently he lives in Laguna Beach, California and is engaged in Bhakti-vriksha propagation.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[24],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-2703","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-congregational-development"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/2703","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=2703"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/2703\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=2703"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=2703"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=2703"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}