{"id":4870,"date":"2007-12-04T12:25:03","date_gmt":"2007-12-04T11:25:03","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/?p=4870"},"modified":"2007-12-04T12:27:44","modified_gmt":"2007-12-04T11:27:44","slug":"what-the-college-students-really-thought-about-new-vrindaban","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/?p=4870","title":{"rendered":"What The College Students Really Thought About New Vrindaban"},"content":{"rendered":"

By Sankirtana Das (ACBSP)<\/strong><\/p>\n

PART 1<\/p>\n

Introduction<\/p>\n

In October a group of about 25 students, along with their professors, visited New Vrindaban (NV). They were part of the Global Leadership Project at Ohio University. For their fall project, the students broke into groups of three and each group was assigned a devotee to interview and to write a paper on their devotee\u2019s Conversion Experience. Caitanya dasa made sure that the devotees consisted of men and women, as well as older and newer devotees. Each group of students conducted several phone interviews with their devotee.<\/p>\n

Also, for a month before their visit, the students extensively researched NV and gathered information from various sources. A number of students even read Monkey On A Stick. Then, for a weekend in October, the students actually visited NV to get a close up view of the community and also to meet their respective devotees.<\/p>\n

Recently, professor Greg Emery forwarded me papers of the students\u2019 reflections of their visit to the community. I thought the raw candor of their observations would be valuable to take a look at in helping devotees to understand how some visitors view the community. The following excerpts are from those student papers.<\/p>\n

Please also see my comments in END NOTES after the excerpts.<\/p>\n

In a few months, the papers the student groups wrote on their devotees\u2019 Conversion Experience will appear on the Harvard Pluralism Project website at Pluralism.org<\/p>\n

******<\/p>\n

Comments About the Devotion of the Devotees<\/p>\n

\u201cTouring the Temple and Palace I was able to see the result of pure faith in one\u2019s God. I can only hope to achieve something as magnificent as a result in my faith in something.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe practices of bhakti yoga, vegetarianism, as well as many other nuances of the religion were apparent in every single devotees\u2019 life.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThey offered love and a genuine sense of care for your well being\u2026 Once you ask them about the religion, they won\u2019t hesitate to talk your ear off.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI appreciated the session on etiquette\u2026 the discussion helped me see that the Hare Krishna\u2019s were not much different than anyone else, and that was very important to me\u2026 I wish the devotees the best of luck in their futures.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI could see that Chris is truly devoted to his religion. It\u2019s amazing to me how much he knows about it, and I have been a Catholic all my life and still do not know some aspects of it.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cIt was amazing to see how dedicated and passionate Tapahpunja was about gardening and agriculture.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cGetting a tour and talking with a women (Jamuna) who seemed to have a great influence on the community and who had been there for a long time was nice.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe most enjoyable part of the trip for me was the meditation during Damodar\u2019s yoga class. It seems that each Hare Krishna, just like everyone else, has their own way to worship and practice their faith.\u201d<\/p>\n

About Kirtana and Dancing<\/p>\n

\u201cWe saw the devotees having a blast and decided to join in and just by our participation they were successful in getting us engaged in their religion.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI was a bit unnerved at the fact that devotees would pull in non-participating people and force then into kirtana with them\u2026 Everyone knew they were welcome to join in if they wanted to\u2026The chanting and dancing was fun. The kirtanas reminded me of taking communion in my church\u2026 the Hare Krishna faith is not far off from Christianity.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe chanting and dancing was simply a blast\u2026 Megan had said that the chanting and dancing made the dedication to Hare Krishna real, and now I knew what she meant\u2026 I found people extremely dedicated to their religion.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI danced and chanted my heart out in the Lord\u2019s name\u2026it felt good to let loose\u2026I felt a sense of disconnectedness from everything else in the world\u2026 I was in the Hare Krishna \u201czone. \u2026 it felt tribal\u2026 far different from anything I have ever experienced inside a Catholic church.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cChristianity on steroids.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cListening and dancing brought me great joy.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe trip seemed like a camping excursion, just with a lot more dancing and chanting to sweeten the deal.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI liked dancing with the Krishnas. It seemed to bring the temple alive, and for a moment I felt like I could understand their faith\u2026.. like a really, really bad camp that was the result of your parents\u2019 good intentions.\u201d<\/p>\n

About the Role of Women<\/p>\n

\u201cOne must remember that the Hare Krishnas follow Vedic law, and as such, their ideas on women\u2019s roles in society are not exactly up to date.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI was disappointed when I found that there was no real place in religious hierarchies for independent, forward thinking women.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI felt like the only purpose for the women in this religion is to procreate and nothing more.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cHare Krishna is a very male dominated religion. Many of the women did not take part in the dancing.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI found it frustrating that men could express themselves more freely then women. I could never live in a community like NV\u2026 Listening and dancing brought me great joy\u2026 I felt somewhat sad. We were leaving this exotic place to return to the \u2018real world.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n

Students\u2019 Reflections On Their Visit<\/p>\n

\u201cAn unforgettable journey ripe with valuable life lessons, unique encounters and cultural education.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI have a respect for the Hare Krishna religion, favorable acquaintances with several devotees, and an understanding of the lifestyle.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cAt the Palace rose garden, Chaitanya das held a rose in his hand and said, how could something like this exist without God? A little seed, some water, and then it rises from the dirt to be one of the most beautiful things, with a wonderful smell unlike any other\u2026 it did make me look at the beautiful surroundings of NV in a new way.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI appreciated what the Krishna Movement showed me about discipline\u2026 self discipline is one of the most rewarding qualities to have\u2026it has helped me to be more aware of what discipline can bring to your life\u2026 I was able to pet a cow, experience a variety of new foods, meet some interesting people \u2013 fun stuff\u2026New Vrindaban showed me another religious walk of life and helped me to experience it\u2026\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI loved the visit because I was able to gather thoughts and opinions by myself without having anything pushed on me\u2026I will always have a certain attraction for the movement, but the weekend showed me that it was not for everyone. Hare Krishna.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cMy experiences were both enjoyable and challenging. It seemed that there was nothing that was not mentally stimulating \u2026Completely out of my comfort zone to be worshiping false Gods\u2026 Krpamaya\u2019s explanation changed me from seeing the deities as elaborately dressed dolls to statues that held a certain amount of credibility\u2026 85% of the time I felt generally \u201ccreeped out.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cMy experience at NV was stranger than any other experience I\u2019ve ever had\u2026I talked with one devotee about the possibility of converting to Hare Krishna\u2026They are living a life style that I could never imagine for myself, and I greatly respect them for their dedication and patience.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cEven though I do not believe in the Deities, the devotees\u2019 devotion and apparent love for them was inspiring.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe constant lecturing which continued throughout the weekend was probably the part I disliked the most\u2026The Krishna lifestyle provided stability to the unstable, spirituality to the skeptic, and love to the lonely\u2026there were things I did enjoy about the religion\u2026the trip was one I will never forget or regret.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe devotees are charismatic, charming and fantastic storytellers. I value many of their philosophies and appreciate their sense of happiness. Nevertheless, I do not find myself converting to become a Hare Krishna anytime soon.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI have gained a better understanding of the religion, its practices, devotees, and unique qualities\u2026 but I would not say I would give NV a \u2018glowing report.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI in no way want to convert, but was able to understand why it was attractive to some people. I am not sure if I had a spiritual awakening, but it definitely was a spiritual vacation.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI would have liked to have more free time to walk around and talk to people rather than sitting and listening to lectures.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI came home exhausted, hungry, sore, and desperately wanting to eat something that was recently alive.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cGo ahead and ask my bank teller, she can tell you all about New Vrindaban!\u201d<\/p>\n

“I felt welcomed and accepted despite living a life in almost perfect contrast to theirs.”<\/p>\n

About NV\u2019s Past<\/p>\n

\u201cSo it was never proven that the people of NV actually killed someone, but even a suspected murder was enough to put fear in my mind.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cNo murders had recently been committed\u2026\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI have to admit, I was a little scared and really didn\u2019t know what to expect at all\u2026 I have gained a better understanding of the religion, it\u2019s practices, devotees and unique qualities.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI had my doubts about Hare Krishna and NV\u2026 while some doubts were subsided, many still remain.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe experience was something I both anticipated and slightly dreaded\u2026a week before our visit, I started to get a nagging sense of fear and trepidation\u2026 despite the worry, I came away from NV with a totally different perspective\u2026.I still think the events of the 80\u2019s and 90\u2019s were beyond creepy, but I don\u2019t think they define the religion. The people we met were so open and willing to answer all our questions about the faith\u2026 I never felt I was being judged nor that the devotees were interested in converting me to their religion.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cNothing gave me the impression of a \u201ccult-like\u201d community\u2026 you can\u2019t be a moderate Krishna like you can with Christianity\u2026. I developed a respect for the Hare Krishna religion.\u201d<\/p>\n

About the Prasadam<\/p>\n

\u201cAlthough I enjoyed the food, I found the taste to be relatively bland in much of it.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cSome of the food was not good at all. I really expected it to be amazing, (because of what I heard about Balaram Chandra\u2019s cooking class on campus).\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe food and people were fantastic aspects of my visit.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe prasadam reminded me of Christianity\u2026just like when you eat the bread and drink the wine in Church, you are taking Christ into your body.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThey served good food and the people were friendly.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cPretty much lunch was inedible.\u201d<\/p>\n

About the Cows<\/p>\n

\u201cThough I am not currently a vegetarian, the man (Balabhadra at ISCOWP) who led us around was very convincing. I wish that people everywhere would treat animals the way this man\u2019s whole philosophy was about just loving cows and treating them with respect.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI was enthralled to actually get to pet and hug a cow and felt relaxed in the presence of this gentle giant\u2026.Walking through the grove with the cows made me feel happy and like there wasn\u2019t anything else in the world going on. The idea that the cows were so gentle because they were treated with love and kindness was such a great message to take home.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cSeeing a cow that huge up close was awesome.\u201d<\/p>\n

About the Skit for the Students<\/p>\n

\u201cThe \u2018spontaneous drama\u2019 was blatant and over the top\u2026 about as subtle as the broad side of a barn\u2026 I felt overly proselytized to.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cThe event that really put me off was the small skit the devotees put on\u2026. I found it offensive the way they portrayed students as drunken idiots and liars. I didn\u2019t appreciate they way they singled us out\u2026. Overall, visiting NV was a positive, life changing experience.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI was offended by the skit. It was painfully obvious that it was directed toward the students.\u201d<\/p>\n

About the Slaying Of Ravana<\/p>\n

\u201cThe slaying of the devil was absurd and meaningless to an outsider.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI found it disturbing.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cIt seemed very cultish when everyone started to dance around the fire and scream the mantra\u2026 Overall it was an interesting and insightful weekend.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cI didn\u2019t like it at all \u2026 the message to kill contradicts my understanding of Vedic beliefs. It reminded me of something out of Lord Of The Flies or the KKK burning of the cross.\u201d<\/p>\n

\u201cIt was so much fun.\u201d<\/p>\n

END NOTES<\/p>\n

The majority of the students walked away from their visit to NV with a positive experience. I think, if nothing else, the students (except for perhaps one or two) accepted the movement as a bona fide and respected religious tradition. It was great to see how often the students mentioned \u201cHare Krishna\u201d in their papers.<\/p>\n

It\u2019s important to understand that even if someone has a negative comment or attitude, it doesn\u2019t mean that they are against the movement or don\u2019t appreciate it.. Some students went from negative or suspicious to favorable (i.e. one student wrote: \u201cI found it frustrating that men could express themselves more freely then women. I could never live in a community like NV\u2026 Listening and dancing brought me great joy\u2026 I felt somewhat sad. We were leaving this exotic place to return to the \u2018real world.\u2019 \u201c).<\/p>\n

So we shouldn\u2019t feel threatened by someone\u2019s negativity, or feel that we have to defeat that negativity with argument. Usually people\u2019s remarks are not inimical, but are made innocently. It\u2019s important not to be annoyed by it, but to deal with each person patiently. Just imagine how patient Srila Prabhupada was with us. Dealing with so many guests, the devotees here in NV are especially cordial. The students appreciated the devotees\u2019 hospitality and many commented on this (i.e.: \u201cI felt welcomed and accepted despite living a life in almost perfect contrast to theirs.\u201d).<\/p>\n

Prabhupada wanted devotees to present Krishna Consciousness (KC) to academia. We have to use our intelligence in presenting various issues so that we can truly help people to consider applying KC in their lives. Also, anyone you talk to will in turn go home and talk to numerous people about their visit (i.e. \u201cGo ahead and ask my bank teller, she can tell you all about New Vrindaban!\u201d).<\/p>\n

Work out a strategy and make sure all the devotees are on the same page. It was embarrassing to have a couple of devotees with little theater know how try to stage an impromptu skit for the visitors. If its important enough to do, than take time to prepare it properly. We can see from student comments about the skit that throwing something together in the last minute is actually counter productive.<\/p>\n

Engage people in KC experiences. On one hand two or three students commented about excessive lectures and talks, but when we did not sufficiently explain about the slaying of Ravana, many students were critical of the event because they didn\u2019t understand it. I take responsibility for this oversight. We need to have a balance in giving people both a proper understanding and the KC experience. And lastly, make sure prasadam is first class since taking prasadam is an important KC experience.<\/p>\n

In PART 2 I will address some of the students’ concerns and questions.<\/p>\n

Sankirtana Das offers presentations on Krishna Consciousness to college students He also performs multicultural and sacred storytelling programs in schools, colleges and a variety of venues. He provides coaching to dramatic artists and writers. He is a recipient of a West Virginia Artist Fellowship Award. He and his wife have resided in New Vrindaban for over 30 years.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

\"HareBy Sankirtana Das (ACBSP)<\/strong><\/p>\n

In October a group of about 25 students, along with their professors, visited New Vrindaban. For their fall project, the students broke into groups of three and each group was assigned a devotee to interview and to write a paper on their devotee\u2019s Conversion Experience.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[2],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-4870","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-articles"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4870","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=4870"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/4870\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=4870"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=4870"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.dandavats.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=4870"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}